NP2112
recently joined
Reged: 07/07/04
Posts: 4
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My decree says that we are supposed to split the incurred daycare expenses. I (the mother) get UT state assistance based my income. My ex thinks we have to split the "out-of-pocket" expenses after the state pays. How can that be correct? It is fraud for him to benefit from my low income status by expecting me to split my benefits with him. If daycare is $1000/mo, and the state pays $563, he should have to pay the balance. It shouldn't matter if my half ($500) is paid for by myself, a friend, family member, or the state, as long as it's paid. The state pays my half and THEN SOME. He cannot take half my benefits to apply to his half of childcare because he is not a qualifying household. Who is correct here? No attorney seems to know. The state doesn't care. He's not paying the full balance after the state pays. Someone has to pay it and I can't afford it, which is why I get state assistance in the first place. I am the one who has to jump through all the hoops for assistance. How can he legally benefit? I need HELP!
Is there any way for me to take this before a judge without an attorney?
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Gecko
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/01/04
Posts: 19803
Loc: Third rock from the sun
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My decree says that we are supposed to split the incurred daycare expenses. I (the mother) get UT state assistance based my income. My ex thinks we have to split the "out-of-pocket" expenses after the state pays. How can that be correct? If daycare is $1000/mo, and the state pays $563, he should have to pay the balance.
---> He is correct. You ACTUAL daycare expense is $437 and you should each be paying $218.50.
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If you air your dirty linen in public, expect people to comment on the skid marks!
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NP2112
recently joined
Reged: 07/07/04
Posts: 4
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How can this be? State assistance is not considered a "discount". The state pays ME so much money a month to use to pay MY expenses. The expenses they are intended for happen to be daycare. So, if what you are saying is correct, then even if a family member stepped in and paid the amount the state paid, then I am still liable for splitting the difference? See the problem? It doesn't matter if my portion is paid for by myself, a friend, a family member, or the State, as long as it is paid. The "incurred expenses" are $1000. That is the actual amount we pay the daycare provider. $500 is the amount each of us would have to pay. Those are the incurred expenses. What you are saying means that state assistance would be treated like a discount, of which it is not. So, by the same token, if I received money for food assistance, I would have to give him half of that? That is fraud. It is illegal for him to come into my home and take MY money from my purse. The money the state gives me is MY money to use for MY childcare expenses. He is not a qualifying household. I am. It's theft. He commits fraud if he takes half my benefits from me. If we split the out of pocket, that is the same as him taking half my benefits and receiving something he's not entitled to. The decree says nothing about out-of-pocket. It states "incurred expenses". The state statute states we are to split all "uncovered" expenses, which applies to Medical ONLY. State assistance is not a "Coverage".
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Gecko
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/01/04
Posts: 19803
Loc: Third rock from the sun
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But it's not you, a friend, a family member paying...it's the State and the States gets it's money from taxes, your ex pays taxes, so you're asking him to pay twice.
If you don't like the answer I gave you, then I suggest you take your butt down to the courthouse and talk to the Judge.
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If you air your dirty linen in public, expect people to comment on the skid marks!
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NP2112
recently joined
Reged: 07/07/04
Posts: 4
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Thank you. I do appreciate your answer. There are just so many ways to look at it, and the whole thing is arguable. I also pay taxes. My taxes are due regardless of what the money is used for. If I didn't get state assistance, his tax liability wouldn't be any lower than it is now.
>But it's not you, a friend, a family member paying...it's the State and the States gets it's money from taxes, your ex pays taxes, so you're asking him to pay twice.
In the same instance as above, I pay taxes, my friends and family members pay taxes. We're all liable for taxes so we're all paying my daycare? He is not paying anything twice. He's paying taxes.
I want to go to the judge. My original question was, how can I do it without paying a fortune (which I don't have) to an attorney?
Thank you for your help. Like I said, I do value it. But the whole thing is arguable. That is why I need to take it to court. Attorneys want thousands in retainers. If I had thousands, I wouldn't be in this mess. Legal aid said they don't have funding for "enforcement issues".
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Gecko
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/01/04
Posts: 19803
Loc: Third rock from the sun
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Yes, it is "arguable" and that's what I was doing...arguing the other side.
And you don't have to pay a "fortune" or otherwise to an attorney, this is something that you can feasibly handle this yourself...it's called an Order to Show Cause. The exact title of the petition could be: Order to Show Cause RE Non-Payment of Childcare Expenses.
In it, you will need the EXACT wording from the Order. Like..."Mother and Father are ordered to split the cost of the minor children's childcare expenses 50/50" and you will need to provide the the courts with a copy of the Order "which is attached as Exhibit 1 and incorporated hereto by reference". You will also want to provide proof of the childcare expense...such as a bill "which is attached as Exhibit 2 and incorporated hereto by reference".
Next you need to outline the problem which is the fact that your ex refuses to pay and why he refuses to pay and what you want the courts to do about it....which is to pay the 50% or rather...the less than 50% since the State is paying more.
You will need at least five copies in addition to the original. The courts will need the original and at least 1 copy if not 2, you will need 1 copy for your records and you will need to "serve" 1 copy to your ex.
You will also need to pay filing fees and for "process of services". Given that you are on State Assistance, you should be able to qualify for a waiver, if not a deferral (payments) of these fees.
Along with your Motion, you will also need to submit a final "Order"...the reason for doing so mainly is in case you get a "default". A "default" is granted when the other party does not "respond".
Once your ex is "served", he will have xx amount of days in which to "respond"...this means that he can "argue" why he hasn't paid and/or why he feels that he should have to pay. You can respond to his "response" or you can just wait until the hearing...doesn't really matter.
IF he responds, the court will issue a date for a hearing and then you both get to talk to the Judge about the issue and a "ruling" is made. Either the Judge will agree with you and "order" you ex to pay the money, or he will agree with your ex and "order" you each to pay the "balance".
IF he doesn't "respond", then you file for a "default" and the Judge will grant your request.
Now here comes the "fun" part...even though the Judge "orders" something, it doesn't mean that your ex will do it. He can either not pay or only pay half of the balance. In either case, you will then have to petition the courts again.
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If you air your dirty linen in public, expect people to comment on the skid marks!
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Gecko
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/01/04
Posts: 19803
Loc: Third rock from the sun
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This is a complicated issue, but you don't need to pay an attorney a "fortune" or otherwise because this is something that you can do yourself.
What you basically have to file is an OSC...an Order to Show Cause. If you want, email me at gecko@comcast.net and I'll help you with it.
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If you air your dirty linen in public, expect people to comment on the skid marks!
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NP2112
recently joined
Reged: 07/07/04
Posts: 4
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I LOVE YOU! lol
Thank you!!! That is what I needed to know. As you can tell, I can debate this issue until I'm blue in the face. It totally irritates me to be able to only "survive", which I'm doing fine as long as I'm in my budget, when my ex is driving around in a new vehicle, living in his new house with his new wife, and taking cruises 2-3 times per year. I pay my living expenses, nothing more. You are awesome and completely respected and appreciated!
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Onyx
old hand
Reged: 08/03/04
Posts: 816
Loc: Buffalo NY
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Gecko *is* awesome. You will find a wealth of info in that brain. :) -Sue
[quote]I LOVE YOU! lol
Thank you!!! That is what I needed to know. As you can tell, I can debate this issue until I'm blue in the face. It totally irritates me to be able to only "survive", which I'm doing fine as long as I'm in my budget, when my ex is driving around in a new vehicle, living in his new house with his new wife, and taking cruises 2-3 times per year. I pay my living expenses, nothing more. You are awesome and completely respected and appreciated! [/quote]
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"Don't Make Me Get My Flying Monkeys"
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