Susanf31
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/05
Posts: 10630
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Based on what Miranda just posted, sounds like $5000 a month is the magic number.
Duration...that's the big question. Most would say 1/2 the length of the marriage. However, given how long it will take her to get retrained and adequately employed and then how many years she has left in the workforce before she retires means she might get a little longer.
The $5000 a month shouldn't decrease over time. Afterall, I don't think it should be rehabilitative. It should be compensatory for the 20+ years she sat out of the workforce...i.e. for the contribution she made to your large income.
I figure your CS, assuming she is working full-time @ $40k a year, will be about $845.
So, with all of this, she will be making $110,000 a year ($60k alimony, $40k income, $10k CS) and you will be making $190,000k. However, out of her $110k must come all of the expenses of the child. $190k will be all yours for only yourself.
Personally, I don't think that's entirely "fair and equitable", I think she should get a bit more, but others will disagree with me.
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rick62
recently joined
Reged: 03/22/07
Posts: 12
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Very helpful. I really appreciate it. Especially the last two paragraphs of the legal text. Thanks Miranda. Where do you find this stuff?
I came up with the number based on what I thought it would take for her to have a "similar" standard of living. Supporting two households... the math will never be even. I can tell you even after the seperation and divorce, that if I have it and she or the kids need it, it is theirs.
Susan, you are right, we have had a lifestyle that few are lucky enough to have. We have been on several cruises, lots of trips to Disney etc. Lots and lots of great memories. The last ten years we have wanted for nothing. (the first fourteen years were a LOT tougher.)
Needless to say, adusting how nice our vaction might be is not the end of the world. We have been so fortunate, far above what we deserve.
Again, I am not trying to find out how little I can get by with, she deserves much, much beter than that.
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TGSM
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 02/06/05
Posts: 5843
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Whatever you do agree to Rick, make sure there is the following language (you definately need an attorney.)
1. Make sure it is ALWAYS modifable. The trend has been for these woman to try and throw in that it's non-modifable. Her attorney will pitch it to you that it can never be adjusted up, etc. That it's a "protection" for you. The fact is alimony is based upon the standard of living at the time of the divorce, not your future earnings. Not to mention if you lose your job, etc. you are stuck paying it. It happened to my husband and there was nothing we could do about it. We went without food and almost lost our house to pay her damn alimony.
2. Make sure you have a clause that alimony automatically ends upon co-habitation or remarriage. If you have the choice, offer less per month for a longer period of time. At 43, there is a good chance she will marry again.
3. Make sure it is labeled as alimony and not "family support" that way you get to write off your taxes the amount you pay her in alimony... (not the child support)
4. Make sure the order has language that states she is to make good efforts at working to be self supporting.
Good luck...it sounds like you are trying to be fair. Your STBX needs to take her share of the responsibility for the choice to stay home. It is NOT your job to make things equal for her.
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Faith-a f*rm belief in something for which there is no proof...complete trust.~Merriam Webster
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rick62
recently joined
Reged: 03/22/07
Posts: 12
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Incredible advice TGSM. Really, thanks.
I will probably get a lawyer, but I want to be careful not to elevate to discourse to a big court battle. That is a small part of the reason I want to be at or above what a judge might order. I suspect what might happen is a lot of cooperation at first and then a period of anger with my wife hiring her own attorney.
I want her attorney to say, "this is pretty fair and you might get less if we go to court." If it comes to that. Which I hope it won't.
However, I need all the help I can get to keep from making long term mistakes in an effort to be fair and not spend a ton of money on unnecessary legal fees.
Any other advice is welcome.
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TGSM
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 02/06/05
Posts: 5843
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Even if you don't hire an attorney to represent you, make sure you have one evaluate ANYTHING before you sign it. You can do that without advertising it to your STBX (soon to be ex.)
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Faith-a f*rm belief in something for which there is no proof...complete trust.~Merriam Webster
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trophywife
member
Reged: 01/26/07
Posts: 166
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I would expect about that much in VA for 12 years.
When you consider she could earn some money right away, that is generous.
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Susanf31
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/05
Posts: 10630
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1. Make sure it is ALWAYS modifable. The trend has been for these woman to try and throw in that it's non-modifable. Her attorney will pitch it to you that it can never be adjusted up, etc. That it's a "protection" for you. The fact is alimony is based upon the standard of living at the time of the divorce, not your future earnings. Not to mention if you lose your job, etc. you are stuck paying it. It happened to my husband and there was nothing we could do about it. We went without food and almost lost our house to pay her damn alimony.
++++++++++
Whoa...I totally disagree with this. You want NON-modifiable!!!! Why? Because you make most of the money and your income increases. There's a chance that she won't be successful in her new career and you don't want her to be able to come back later and say she wants/needs more. It's in the higher-wage earners best interest to get non-modifiable.
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TGSM
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 02/06/05
Posts: 5843
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Rick,
Don't listen to Susan...she is someone who RECEIVED alimony and her advice is going to be biased to that effect. My DH and I lived this situation and ended up having to pay that money when we didn't have it to give. We almost lost EVERYTHING because of it. Our children SUFFERED because of it...and we were raising one of HER kids too and she took that money to HIS detriment as well.
Her amount of alimony is based upon your income and standard of living at the time of your divorce...not your future earnings. Making it nonmodifable has a better chance of biting you in the butt rather than helping you. If you make it nonmodifable for ten plus years, you are basically GAMBLING that you are not going to...face layoff, be injured or other life threatening issues that can and do happen. That's a mighty big gamble...one you can't fix later on. Trust me BTDT...our hell finally ends on June 30, 2007.
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Faith-a f*rm belief in something for which there is no proof...complete trust.~Merriam Webster
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rick62
recently joined
Reged: 03/22/07
Posts: 12
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Thanks TGSM,
I am glad your nightmare is about to end.
That makes total sense to me. My job is actually REALLY volatile. I have been with the same company in several different roles for 10 years, and have had a great run during that time. However, two missed quarters in a row and I could be unemployeed or have significant earning decreases.
The odds are a lot better that she could make $60k than I could keep this income level for 10-12 years.
From everything I have read, whatever is in the agreement becomes God from that moment forward. Makes the stakes pretty high to get it right.
I know Susan means well. Like all of us, our personal experiences affect our paradigms.
Rick
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googledad
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 12/31/05
Posts: 10207
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Just an idea , but if you can afford , why not buy out some of those years of alimony with a lump sum payment ? Right now you're talking about $60k for 12 years = $720k . If you own your house would it be possible to reduce that amount by ceding whatever equity you would be entitled to for it to her ? The same could hold true for other marital property .
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Careful. We don't want to learn from this.
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