gwandjsmommy
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Please help... my ex relocated 4 hours away when our daughter was in Kindergarten (we have been divorced since she was 1 and she is now going into the 4th grade). I have primary physical custody and we have joint legal. Every other weekend during the school year we meet 1/2 way on Friday night and then again on Sunday night so that she can spend the weekend with him in his home. During the summers she goes to his house for 2 weeks and then to mine for 1 week. We continue that schedule through the summer.
My question... how do we handle weekends when she wants to go to a school function or when she wants to play soccer and the games are on the weekends? My ex sees the schedule in black and white~ no gray areas. At what age do we consider her interests and social life? Her dad talks to her every other night and is a good dad. It is important for her to spend time with both of us, but with the distance of 4 hours it is complicated... close enough for every other weekend visits, too far for allowng her to participate in a Saturday event and still travel the disance to see her dad. Also, he is not willing to come and spend the weekend down here.
Any advice? :confused:
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elliesmom
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In my experience most coaches etc. are aware that many kids have another parent every other weekend who may not bring them. I tried to explain in advance and made a little extra effort to volunteer even when the kids weren't there to try and make up for the inconvenience. There were 1 time events that we tried to plan for. Like homecoming dance is in 4 weeks and on your weekend, can we trade it for next weekend or the one after (giving plenty of notice and more than one workable option). Or since its friday can we meet saturday morning.
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Forgiveness is...letting go of the hope that the past can be changed.
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gwandjsmommy
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That would be great if m ex thought that things like homecoming dance were important. He has literally told me that nothing is more important than her spending time with him at his house. Now, I do agree for the most part... but that is kindof like saying that nothing is more important that your children and then not going to a work meeting because they are home/not in school. I just wish that we could all find a balance.
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elliesmom
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Well I would agree - but agreeing to switch weekends or make up the time some other way does not detract from his time with her. If you can show that you have repeatedly attempted to make arrangements (that involve switching not LOSING any time) and you gave him ample notice and he refused to negotiate in any way, you may be able to modify your decree to indicate what you do when a conflict comes up - switch weekends, time made up over your holidays, time made up in the summer. Or try and trade him giving him one of your 3 day weekends that come along. Or ask him what he thinks would be a fair way to make sure she gets to participate but doesn't lose any time with Dad.
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Forgiveness is...letting go of the hope that the past can be changed.
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kkimberh
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With a 4 hour distance, you really should be looking at a long-dstance schedule. I know in my state, anything over 100 miles is considered long-distance. That's way too much travel time every other weekend. I would file to modify it to a long-distance plan. Because he created the distance, he really should be responsible for transportation, but you've already been meeting halfway so I'm not sure if they would change it. While filing to modify, you can add language about allowing her to attend school functions, etc.
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Avaya
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[quote]That would be great if m ex thought that things like homecoming dance were important. He has literally told me that nothing is more important than her spending time with him at his house. [/quote]
If that's how he feels you have to honor the visitation schedule. A time will come when she will put up a fuss with him and he will either bend or he wont - but chances are he will. In 4th grade, I wouldn't consider homecoming that big of a deal either. I think time will take care of this. You can always ask to switch weekends though, when there is something special she wants to attend. I really think though, that you will have a better chance of seeing him give in a little if you FULLY support his position with your daughter and don't make him the bad guy just because he says no. If you support him then I think most reasonable people (and he sounds reasonable - sticking to all of his visitation) would come to a reasonable solution when the time is right.
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Eternity is too long to be wrong.
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Avaya
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[quote]Or ask him what he thinks would be a fair way to make sure she gets to participate but doesn't lose any time with Dad. [/quote]
Great option!
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Eternity is too long to be wrong.
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Avaya
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[quote]With a 4 hour distance, you really should be looking at a long-dstance schedule. I know in my state, anything over 100 miles is considered long-distance. That's way too much travel time every other weekend. [/quote]
Boo-Hiss!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Girls NEED their daddys! Doesn't matter who created the distance; it's workable and they've been doing it for a lot of years just fine. This age is NOT the age to decrease time with daddy.
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Eternity is too long to be wrong.
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kkimberh
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Who said anything about decreasing time? There are ways to make the schedule more manageable in a long-distance situation without decreasing time. In a lot of ways, and a lot of situations, it causes a BETTER relationship w/ daughters and daddies because of the decrease in travel time and longer stretches of time together. Their time together is longer and of much better quality than a rushed weekend, even if it is every other weekend...
And trust me - I was as big a daddy's girl there ever was before my dad died. I KNOW all about how important a daddy is to a little girl, or a grown girl for that matter.
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I love therapy. It's like a talk show, where I'm the guest and the only topic is me.
Edited by kkimberh (07/26/12 10:54 AM)
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Avaya
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During the school year there isn't much opportunity for dad to get more time than EOWE, so a change to some long distance plan would most certainly decrease that time.
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Eternity is too long to be wrong.
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youngatheart
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Yup, I agree.
1) moving patent should be doing all transportation.
2) kids should be able to attend their activities. That's my favorite part of my court order.
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Goodmom
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Reged: 06/17/07
Posts: 2006
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You said:
Boo-Hiss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
My response:
BAER!!!!!!!!!!!
You said:
Girls NEED their daddys!
My response:
Then Daddy shouldn't have moved so far away.......
You said:
Doesn't matter who created the distance; it's workable and they've been doing it for a lot of years just fine.
My response:
It's really not that workable, as is evidenced by the OP's concern and the father refusing to see that his child shouldn't have to miss out on extracurricular activities because of his selfish choice to move so far away.
Unfortunately for the child, status quo of EOW has been established. So she's going to miss out on a lot because of her father's selfish choice to move so far away.
You said:
This age is NOT the age to decrease time with daddy.
My response:
Then Daddy should have thought of that BEFORE he moved so far away.
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gr8Dad
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You ASSUME that he CHOSE to move. You, actually, have NO idea WHY he moved. Maybe he was military, maybe he got transferred, maybe he lost his job and had to move for a new one, so he could pay the CHILD SUPPORT. But, of course, you are KNOWN for your bias as well as your jumping to a conclusion before all of the FACTS are known, so this really isn't a surprise.
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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...
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finz
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Heck, a NCP can live MUCH closer and not want to 'lose' their time with a child to sports or other activities that the CP signed them up for.
I think BOTH parents and the child should agree to the planned activity or the child shouldn't sign up for it.....IF it is the type of activity where teammates would be adversely affected. In my area, with soccer and t-ball for younger kids it wouldn't really matter if some kids couldn't be there each practice or gameday. For a lot of older kid activities, at least in my area, it matters A LOT if a football or baseball players misses practicies and games. For them, if you can't meet the committment, you shouldn't sign up.
I think it's important to start with younger kids that the expectation that they spend NCP's weekends WITH the NCP, with VERY few exceptions......so that as they get older they won't want to 'opt out' of spending time at NCP's for every minor 'occassion'.....like "ALL the kids are going to the movies together" etc.
As kids get older, there will be enough major 'occassions' like best friend's birthday, school dances, etc that can really cause anger issues/resentment with teems if they aren't 'allowed' flexibility in the schedule.
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gwandjsmommy
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Dad moved because of his job.. I actually thought about following him, but couldn't guarantee he would even be in this location for long. we had to get on with our lives. He is a good dad, i just hate that my daughter is constantly missing things like her best friend's birthday party, her piano recital, etc. He has told me that he will not consider switching the schedule (I never ask him to give up time~ only to switch) unless it benefits him or our daughter and I guess he does not see those things benefitting him directly or our daughter. He has specifically said, "She will be disappointed, but she will get over it." I worry that she will resent not only him, but me for not demanding for her desires ( I know these are not "needs" to at least be considered.
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Avaya
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What if you pick a neutral time - a time when you DON'T want something and you don't want to switch - to sit down with him and say "She's getting older and there are going to be things she wont want to miss with her friends. Can we make a list of things you would consider important enough to switch weekends over? We can still decide on each event as it comes up, but if we both share our thoughts now, we can have a better idea what the other's perspective is with regard to birthday parties, dances, sports, etc."
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Eternity is too long to be wrong.
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gwandjsmommy
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I like that idea and I will try it. Thank you! Do you think that fourth grade is an unreasonably young age to bring that up?
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BlueGoldgirl
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"...she will be disappointed, but she will get over it..."
So this is what he is saying, and the child is only in 4th grade? IMO dad is going to be in for a bit of an awakening a few years down the road. Mine is going into 8th grade and her father will not allow her to do anything when she is home with him. This has been taking place for six years. He says that it is his time with her, and he will choose what they do together.
While a child may get over life's occasional disappointments...many that are subjected to constant disappointments do not. They understand what is going on, and however they choose to respond to it does surface at some point. Our daughter began struggling with her dad in 5th grade. He is now in court-ordered therapy with our daughter.
Good Luck to you both. I feel parents should agree and compromise on activities that their kids can do.
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wowlijetgold
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Avaya
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[quote]I like that idea and I will try it. Thank you! Do you think that fourth grade is an unreasonably young age to bring that up? [/quote]
Yes, I do think that's a little young. To kids, everything is a big deal; but they do get over it pretty quickly. On Friday they'll tell you they're gonna DIE if they don't get to go to Suzie's sleepover; on Monday they shrug it off and say they were glad they didn't go because Suzie's brother terrorized the girls or Suzie's mom got mad at Suzie's dad or because Sally and Jenny got in a fight at the sleepover or because her own best friend couldn't go and she'd have been the odd man out.....In my experience above ALL kids crave consistency - and in my opinion that primarily equates to mom and dad sticking together in what they tell the kid. Yes, the kid can handle adjustments to the schedule just fine but it's infinitely better when both parents are on board about agreeing to the change in the schedule rather that one being strong armed.
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Eternity is too long to be wrong.
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ssmom79
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In my experience above ALL kids crave consistency - and in my opinion that primarily equates to mom and dad sticking together in what they tell the kid.
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c_jane
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[quote]In my experience above ALL kids crave consistency - and in my opinion that primarily equates to mom and dad sticking together in what they tell the kid. [/quote]
And if Father of the Year is CONSISTANT in telling kid 'no you can't do ANYTHING you want on my time' pretty soon the message will sink in. And she will begin telling her friends "what weekend is your birthday party on? oh, that's my Dad's weekend. I know I can't go".
And the resentment will build, and build, and build -- until Teenage Girl will totally rebel and it will KILL any relationship she was EVER going to have with Father of the Year. Bet on it.
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John Constantine: God's a kid with an ant farm.... He's not planning anything.
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gr8Dad
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You are a PERFECT example of why our society is FVCKED. You seem to think that the PARENT, the one who is in CHARGE< and who PAYS for everything, and is RESPONSIBLE for everything, should give up MORE< so that the CHILD, who is subordinate at best, will not be MAD at them.
Anyone here old enough to remember when, "Because I said so" was the only explaination needed for you, the child, to SHUT THE FVCK UP?
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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...
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ssmom79
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You and your ex are only consistent at being enemies. That also gets picked up by the child and parents should be wary of that as well.
It is true however that if a parent consistently says not on my time, she will learn what weekend is what and say no. Will the resentment build and build? Maybe, maybe not, it depends on the child and how they were raised.
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elliesmom
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I think if Dad remains inflexible and will not change for any event in spite of the child's request - she will get very resentful. Any teenager will wonder "why can't we swap weekends?" And quickly come to the conclusion "because dad is an a-hole."
Just because the child respects her fathers wishes as her father - doesn't mean she won't hate him. Teenagers are quickly adults who are under NO custody order. Teenagers who are treated this way will be adults who don't call and don't come over. Because the only reason they ever did it was because they ALWAYS HAD TO. Now they don't and won't.
Truthfully we are in the same position. We did eow at 4 hours away for years. But SD17 has a life. She loves her Dad. So he handed her a calendar and said pick out when you want to come and I want to see you at least once a month. It has worked out well. She has strong-armed her mother out of almost every holiday so she can come and spend a longer time here. Sometimes we have skip September (annual tradition with mom one weekend, homecoming game the next, homecoming dance the next, etc. Sept. is CRAZY), but she just spent most of August here so its no biggy. It is always best to avoid ruling teenagers by force -- unless you have no choice because they are doing something dangerously detrimental.
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Forgiveness is...letting go of the hope that the past can be changed.
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kkimberh
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How flexible you are with them as teens is going to determine what kind of relationship you have with them as adults. Any parent knows that. It is simply more pronounced in a split family situation. A resentful teenager is going to see their 18th birthday as 'freedom from dad day' (or mom). If they are spending their teen years and possibly before that HAVING to visit, are they really going to CHOOSE to visit once they don't have to?
Besides, once our kids are teens, how much time do we really spend with them, even if they are in our own house? It's just me and dd, and besides taking her to practice, or to school some mornings, or to shows, she's off creating her own life - as it should be...
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I love therapy. It's like a talk show, where I'm the guest and the only topic is me.
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ssmom79
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I wonder if this parent will change his thinking when the child is a teen? It's easy to say, I am going to do A, B, C with my kid...then your kid comes along and reminds you life isn't always A, B, C....sometimes it's G, K, S or some other weird combination.
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gr8Dad
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"Just because the child respects her fathers wishes as her father - doesn't mean she won't hate him."
Hey, if my teenagers occasionally hate me or resent me, do you know what that means? It means I am doing my JOB as a PARENT. Guess what, occasionally, I hate my BOSS, but I listen to him, because he pays me (not directly, but you get the point). The WHOLE GENERATION that is coming up right now, that is convinced life OWES them, and they don't have to do stuff because its not FUN, is going to cause MAJOR problems.
Do you know who I REALLY feel bad for? My kids. My people are half gerneationalist. Not yuppies, not genX. Its our job to clean up the mess from the generation before. My kids will have to clean up after these spoiled snots.
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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...
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ssmom79
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The WHOLE GENERATION that is coming up right now, that is convinced life OWES them, and they don't have to do stuff because its not FUN, is going to cause MAJOR problems.
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Already causing major problems, imagine the parents who just can't say no because it's not fun, building up debt using credit to buy things they cannot afford.
SD was left with two credit cards to buy school clothes....she was told only use $XX on one card because it's almost maxed out. Not only that, she's keeps raising the quality of jeans she NEEDS. No longer is Aeropostale OK, American Eagle is wrong, Hollister paves way to Abercrombie and before you know it, she's expecting to wear Hudson jeans at $240 a pop because someone owes her that. HORRIBLE thought process and difficult to stop. So not only is she maxing cards, she's teaching the child that you can buy now what you cannot afford and pay it back later.
I did breed into that monster buying Coach bags and AE jeans but I pay cash for the things I buy and I save money to buy things with cash. So darnit why can't that pick that up instead of give me a credit card and I'll make payments!
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elliesmom
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I don't consider someone who wants no relationship with a parent, because that parent refused to EVER consider respecting their desire to engage in a social activity, to be a spoiled brat.
In fact I would say that someone who doesn't give a cr@p about what I want - already has no relationship with me.
I am not saying what the kid wants trumps all - but if dad remains completely inflexible - they will have a poor or no relationship with their teen/adult. And it will be his fault. You can consider the feelings of others, including your child, without being ruled by them. Good parents do it all the time. My child may want to do something that either conflicts with other events or puts too great a strain on our family resources that would require a "no." Presumably if you haven't raised awful kids - a teenager can easily understand WHY it has to be "no." (At least in my experience). But if "no" is reflexive and without explanation - they will resent it. And as adults - exercise their right to not include someone who has no regard for them in their lives. As any healthy person would.
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Forgiveness is...letting go of the hope that the past can be changed.
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gr8Dad
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I think since the child is in 4th grade, it may be a TAD too early to say what he will do when the child is a teenager, wouldn't you say?
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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...
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elliesmom
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I agree. But I don't think it is too early to start talking about it. 4th grade is about when it starts. No need to wait until you have a resentful teenager. I find it odd that he has never wanted to change himself. In all these years he's NEVER had something come up in his life he wanted to have his child there for?
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Forgiveness is...letting go of the hope that the past can be changed.
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gr8Dad
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"In all these years he's NEVER had something come up in his life he wanted to have his child there for?"
Trust me, as a non custodial DAD in a custody situation, you learn to plan your life with the kids around your EOW, because even ASKING for a switch can become a headache.
And lets be honest, on this site alone, how many NCP's come on complaining that the CP won't switch weekends? Hardly ANY. Why? Because when you have been made a vistor in your child's life, you learn to operate as a second class citizen, because that is exactly what the court makes you.
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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...
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elliesmom
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Meh. DH always asked. Before the 1st time they went back to court she always told him to F off. After that she usually said yes. Mainly because she realized under the new custody order giving him almost all of the decision making - she was going to need his cooperation sometimes. The main reason he GOT that order - was because he could demonstrate easily she always said "no."
We didn't ask for dumb stuff, but family weddings/reunions etc. don't always get planned with your kids in mind. Family work picnics etc.
I am not getting a "F off" vibe from her - so I guess I find it curious.
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Forgiveness is...letting go of the hope that the past can be changed.
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ssmom79
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Heck yea, my life revolves around 'wait, let me see if I have the kids'. I love it though so I shouldn't complain!
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