SteelersJR1
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Reged: 10/03/05
Posts: 693
Loc: PA
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I ran into an ex-coworker tonight that happens to now work with my STBX. We've been separated for 3 months. 2 days after we were separated, she had someone move in. She felt "sorry for him-he'd been kicked out of his home". (She's 32, he's 19. She has a 15 yr old daughter & my 52 yr old son). My co worker said that she approached him seveal weeks ago & said how happy she was. I don't think she really is, I think she either hoped that info would get to me or she's trying to convince herself. Anyway, even though I know it's over & I'm trying to concentrate on my son & getting my life put back together, it's damn hard not to get upset about this kind of stuff. How do you guys hold it together? I've watched other people go through divorce & they are either deserving of Academy Awards or it washes off like dust. I can't sleep, I can't eat, I have a hard time concentrating at work; basically, I'm obsessed with the situation. HELP! How do you gather enough energy to crawl out of bed in the morning, let alone function like a reasonably sane human being? I pick different places to shop solely to avoid running into them. Where is the "chart" that says, "OK, your life going to REALLY suck for the next 273 days. Then it will only be really bad for the next 158 days. After that, you'll only be thinking about your ex 4-5 times a day". There's got to be some sort of relief from this crap. I have a 5 yd old son I miss like fire. I got to talk to him this afternoon for 3 minutes. That's the first I've talked to him in 51 days. (SOME extenuating circumstances, but mostly, my STBX is a #$%^@. I'm getting hosed more than a 3 alarm fire here. Suggestions?
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kav
old hand
Reged: 06/10/05
Posts: 816
Loc: NC
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Geoff
Been there, done that. First of all people should not fill you in on what your stbx says. There is no good reason for that.
My my stbx left me, I was where you are and it's not easy. I didn't want to get out of bed, I couldn't concentrate at work. My whole world as I knew it feel apart. I went to a therapist that suggested a support group. She also suggested that I get on an anti-depressant. My doctor agreed with her. I take the train to work (an hour commute) and it was hard to fight back the tears. My thoughts were constantly on my marriage. Every day I thought if I died it would be a blessing. The anti-depressants really helped me. I could focus and the thoughts of my marriage weren't as strong.
You have to force yourself to live, you have to "fake it until you make it". I forced myself to go out with co-workers and to go to functions with friends, dreading every minute of it. But it got easier.
You mentioned "Sleepless in Seattle" in one of your posts. Remember when Tom Hanks said to the therapist from the radio station that he reminds himself to wake up and breath everyday until one day hopefully he will just wake up and breath. That's how it is. Trust me, with each day it gets a little easier. One day you find yourself saying "this isn't so bad, doing what I want, when I want". You'll get there, just hang on. Think about a support group or talking to a therapist, it really helps.
In the mean time, we're here for you whenever you need us. You have our support and our prayers. You will survive!!! Look at how far people come in life on this board. It happens. My therapist told me this is the worse thing anyone will go through in life except for burying a child. No truer words were ever spoken. It is the worse thing you will go through. But it makes you stronger and it makes you better. Someday down the line you will look at your stbx and think that you are so much better off without her.
Hang in there.
Hugs!!!
Kim
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Yesterday I dared to struggle. Today I dare to win.
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AnneB
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 09/21/05
Posts: 3645
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I have been reading your posts, and I wanted to tell you how sorry I am for your situation. It must be so hard to be away from your son.
What Kim said is right--some days you have to remind yourself to breathe. My divorce happened in 2001, and while I certainly wouldn't want to compare what I went through to what the families of the 9/11 victims went through, a friend of mine said it was sort of like someone blew up my home and family.
Briefly, we had been married over 20 years, our daughter was a freshman in college , and our son was 11. My ex decided he wanted a divorce so he could marry a female he had met at work and begun an affair with who was 5 years older than our daughter. I couldn't eat, couldn't sleep, cried all the time and most of the time wanted to die. The only thing that got me through it was the bitter custody fight we had over our son. Betrayal is a pain like no other--it is like someone has your heart in a vice grip and certain smells, places and songs will make you feel like someone is tightening it. I am 4 years down the road today, and even though I don't cry every day, and the pain has lessened, it hasn't gone away. Because we had been together so long it was so hard when our daughter graduated from college and he wasn't there, got married, had her first child, etc. You seem to be much younger so perhaps things will go better for you--soon you will know how it is when you get older!
I am always telling people that if I win the Texas lottery I am going to spend all my money lobbying for reform in family law. The person who wants to break up the home to be with someone else has to give up custody and all the assets--what do you think? Think I can get that passed?!!!
My son has had the same girlfriend since last March. Her family is originally from Pennysylvania. Her dad has always been a Steelers fan and still has season tickets. At the last game he went to, someone different was in the seats next to his season tickets and it was the rock band Korn (no way to make the backward K). He had never heard of them! My son thinks that is so funny as even I have heard of them. You all can make fun of the Dallas Cowboys all you want but don't EVER make fun of those University of Texas Longhorns--here in Austin we bleed orange!
Don't give up fighting for your son. She sounds like a mental case--don't you wonder what you saw in her? I hope she is at least very good to your son--other than what she has done to you. Kids get so messed up by dysfunctional parents. In my almost 30 years of teaching, off and on, and 25 years of being a parent, I have seen lots of kids with poor excuses for parents. It is really sad.
Hang in there--time doesn't heal all wounds but it does stop the bleeding...
Anne
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SteelersJR1
addict
Reged: 10/03/05
Posts: 693
Loc: PA
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Kim,
I know. You're right. What sucks about this whole thing is that, while I definitely wasn't the best husband in the world, I tried to be a good one. I worked on my problems & our issues. She apparently made her decision years ago. I also know that she'll be "not happy" relatively soon. I can't see a 19 year old being content when the world is out there, ready to be conquered. On the other hand, I don't WANT to see her hurt, although she's obviously not been concerned about my (or the kids') feelings. And I know it's hopeless, but I still get those "if I could only talk to her" feelings. Actually, this WILL be good for us both-too many differences to make it "all the way", but it still hurts to watch it get flushed away. I also have to just sit back and watch her ruin all our assets. We bought a house last year-I'm not paying the mortgage because that's what support is for, but she needs something like $4500.00 in about 25 days or they start foreclosure. (She has a brand new car I bought for her in June-she makes payments on that, her AOL account & the satellite dish. I know people have to live but be realistic-that money isn't going to fall from the sky). Then there's the kids. What kind of environment is that for 2 kids to live in? Apparently, my son crawled into our bed a few months ago-"loverboy" was there. But, I can only sit & watch. (If that had happened on my end, I'd probably wind up in jail again somehow). It just really chaps my rear that I have NO recourse but to allow it to run it's course. (hmm, there's that nasty "P" word patience again). I really try not to whine, but, from where I sit, no matter HOW you slice it, this issue REEKS like decay.
Geoff
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kav
old hand
Reged: 06/10/05
Posts: 816
Loc: NC
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And you can whine if you want. Frankly, I don't see it as whining though, you're just blowing off steam. You have to go through your stages, just like when someone close to you dies. Now you're feeling sadness and it's hard. Me, I couldn't wait to reach anger. It's certainly a better emotion. Your situation is tough, you have the connection with your son. It's too bad that he sees so much and even worse that you know about it. When my stbx came by tonight to discuss the divorce, the first thing I told him was don't volunteer any information to me that I don't ask for. I don't want to know what he does, why he does it or when he's doing it. I just want it all out of my head. These relationships with the younger partners that everyone seems to want to get involved in, I just don't see many of them lasting. Someday your stbx may wake up and realize what a good thing she lost. That feeling they get from being with someone so much younger has to fade at some point. Then what are they left with? Dealing with the immaturity that they already lived through so many years ago.
Kim
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Yesterday I dared to struggle. Today I dare to win.
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SteelersJR1
addict
Reged: 10/03/05
Posts: 693
Loc: PA
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Anne, thanks for the support. Sometimes I feel like telling myself to suck it up & move on, but this seriously has wiped me out, both financially and emotionally. There are SO many other parts to this mess-I swear that someday I'll be rich after selling the TV rights to one of the networks. I know that someday, I'll look back & say "Whew! I'm glad that ended!" But it's just that long road off into the distance to get there that is so intimidating. (I AM seeing a therapist-have been for over a year. I WAS on anitdepressants-certain circumstances forced me to stop taking them). A HUGE part of my loneliness is the fact that I have no family closer than 250 miles. I was pretty close to her family, her mother and an aunt in particular, I haven
t talked to either of them for almost the entire 3 months. I'm about 99 44/100s % sure that they are "on my side" even though they're blood. Not that it matters, but as far as I know, neither my STBX or my son have seen them since. But they would be a huge source of emotional support for me-they were the last time I saw them, which was after the split.
I also agree with you about the family law reform. It is WAY too easy to get out instead of working on issues. There ought to at least be some "punishment" if someone feels like they don't want to try. Currently, people can go into a marriage knowing there's an easy out if they want.
I would love to have season tickets for the Steelers! I live about 4.5 hours from Pittsburgh, but it would be worth it! (My son also loves the Steelers & the Pens!) Thanks for the support, again, I know "in the long run" everything will work to God's plan. Geoff
Hook'em Horns!
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AnneB
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 09/21/05
Posts: 3645
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Don't tell yourself to suck it up and move on! The only way to get "through" the pain is to go through it--no matter how long it takes. Trying to make yourself get over it only promotes artificial or superficial healing. It is so sad that you have to go through that much pain to start getting over it.
As Kim said the anger stage is much better than the heartbroken and then denial stages. The anger stage makes it easier to look out for yourself and your child than the heartbroken stage where you subconsciously tell yourself that if you are nice enough she will realize what she is giving up and apologize and try to make amends so you can get back together. Ask yourself right now if you would even want her back if she did that. After all the awful, terrible things she has done to you, could you ever be sure she was doing it for the right reasons? Her behavior transcends the just basic affair--she has gone way over the line.
I think the worst thing the court has done is go from one extreme to the other--from making it too hard to get a divorce to waaaaaay too easy for the most part. And then it is too easy and quick to just remarry without anyone getting time to heal--the children too which is a real factor for older kids.
I know you must be a Yankee, but if you know "hook 'em horns" you are alright in my book! Although I am kidding, I have been surprised how many people have never heard of the Texas Longhorns--that is like not hearing of the USC Trojans or something. Where have these people been!!! I said something to someone yesterday about Louis Farrakhan saying that the government blew up the levees in NOLA and the person had never heard of him either. Of course when my kids were little I spent most of my time reading One Fish, Two Fish and Hey Diddle Diddle so maybe they have a legitimate excuse too!
Anne
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passem
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Reged: 06/26/04
Posts: 463
Loc: Left Coast
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"The person who wants to break up the home to be with someone else has to give up custody and all the assets--what do you think? Think I can get that passed?!!!"
Sometimes the home is best broken up and doing so is not always a reflection on parenting skills. As for the assets ~~ slavery, bondage and indentured servitude disappeared in this country with the Thirteenth Amendment.
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Depression is merely anger without passion!
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AnneB
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 09/21/05
Posts: 3645
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such a wonderful thing and lacking in so many.
NO home is best broken up by cheating. Period. If the home needs to be divided it should be divided with integrity by getting a divorce FIRST.
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SteelersJR1
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Reged: 10/03/05
Posts: 693
Loc: PA
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wow, passem-you lost me. what do "assets" have to do with the 13th Amendment? and to quote: "Sometimes the home is best broken up and doing so is not always a reflection on parenting skills." AnneB said it all. I cheated in my 1st marriage & I'm still and probably always will regret every moment my wife lay awake waiting for me. I was a fool and lost a lot-I'm not talking about financial, I'm talking about missing my daughter grow up. I didn't see school plays. I didn't teach her how to ride a bike. I missed the proms and 1st date. I didn't get a chance to teach her how to drive. I thank God every day that we are able to be close now. I couldn't blame her if she didn't want to have anything to do with me. A home is NOT a home when there are outside "things" going on. I had no integrity 17 years ago. My current wife has none now. Are we the same? In many ways, yes. We both are/were looking for fulfillment that we obviously weren't/aren't getting with our spouses. But the similarity ends there. My ex-wife and I still talk to this day. She offered to be a character witness in my trial if I needed her. My STBX is for herself. Period. She has no compunction in who she hurts, including her children. I'm not saying that from a revenge angle. I'm saying it because I watch her "raise" her daughter for 7 years, and saw that child get no discipline and not a lot of love. i DID see her get taught that it's OK to lie to the school if you don't feel like going. I saw her be taught that it's OK to "just get by" in school work. I saw her be taught that courtesy and respect are things that aren't important, as long as you get what you want. Rearing children, teaching them what is right and wrong, how to live with compassion and respect-THOSE are what make a house a home. Not people alone. Why bother with marriage at all if we open the door to "no-fault"? Isn't it ALWAYS someone's fault? It may be both together, but the divorce fairy doesn't drop out of the sky & wave her magic wand. Not working at the issues are a fault. Now, granted, there hasto be an out-if for no other reason than to keep the murder rate down a few hundred thousand a year, but why do we make it so easy? Again, because we teach our kids and each other that there's no reason to try. You can always find someone else. Why bother with this one? The next one's just over the horizon. We as a country, a culture, a society, have enabled ourselves to "get out BEFORE the going gets tough" , instead of "when the going gets tough, the tough get going". We don't try anymore because it's too unpopular.
Geoff
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SteelersJR1
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Reged: 10/03/05
Posts: 693
Loc: PA
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Anne,
I've been a college football fan for years. (by the way, I'm 44). So I know the 'Horns, the Horned Frogs, Runnin' Rebs, you name it, I can name them! Like I just posted, our society has become too easy-we have to be careful what we say & who we say it to, lest we find ourselves being sued. There is a playground less than 300 yards from where I grew up. Last summer, I couldn't takemy son there because they had closed it due to fear of insurance claims. Whatis wrong with this world???
Geoff
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passem
addict
Reged: 06/26/04
Posts: 463
Loc: Left Coast
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thinly veiled attempts to discredit me here rather amusing, I guess I'm not one of them. ;)
Serious people have attempted to pass such laws in the past in many states, including mine, in which I happen to work in politics. While laughable, they still consume time and resources.
Have a nice day!
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Depression is merely anger without passion!
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passem
addict
Reged: 06/26/04
Posts: 463
Loc: Left Coast
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I have no argument with anything you said, Steelers. I touched upon the elements of the 13th Amendment which was my way of saying that erring doesn't equate to being reduced to penury.
Without fault I still lost 10 years of my two youngest daughter's lives through the vagaries of the legal system and the society we've all contributed to one way or another.
We all have demons to slay. It's the human condition.
For the record, you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who deplores the "ease" of divorce more than me because all too many do, as you pointed out, take the easy way out rather than doing the hard work necessary to make a relationship/marriage work.
In my personal case it worked out well in the end and made my current marriage possible but at the time of it, it was nothing less than devastating, even with a cheating spouse.
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Depression is merely anger without passion!
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Rebecca5
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/05
Posts: 11697
Loc: Down home.
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I've thought about this for a while now. It's a hard question to answer for people like me....who were the ones who ended their marriages. I felt very, very sad for my children....and I felt sorry for my ex, but I was glad to see it end. Long story there, and this isn't about me.
Soooo....I asked DH. He caught his wife in bed with another man, whom she promptly moved (with their 3 children) into their marital home before the ink on the temp papers was dry. I felt like you all had some things in common and his advice would be much better than anything I could think of.
He said he spent as little "alone time" as possible. Alone time just led to thinking, and thinking was a bad thing at that point. He spent most of his time with his friends, but they eventually got tired of hearing about her, you know? He says this would have been his depression phase. The worst part was that many of his closest friends, and the people he would have talked to about his deepest, darkest secrets were on "her" side of the divorce....mostly because they were members of her family. So he grieved for not only her, but his whole way of life.
So then he felt like he didn't have anyone to talk to and "no one cared." He said he almost welcomed the "anger," because it didn't hurt nearly as bad as the depression. Budweiser became a good friend. He says he wouldn't recommend that as a way to cope...the morning just looks crappier with a hangover. :-)
Eventually, his best friend started coming back around and drug him out of the house. He helped him find a great support group that happened to be at a local church. He found that he really enjoyed the atmoshpere and started attending during services. After a couple months, he became very involved with this new family, who welcomed him in....faults and all. Other than some semblence of peace on the inside, he says he loved setting a good example for his kids. Everyday was another step toward becomming more focused on the kind of man he wanted his boys to be, even during the times when she tried to keep them apart. He still regrets the rough days, but feels like he has certainly made up some time.
Mostly, he says.....attempt to stay busy. Volunteer somewhere....join a club or 10.....spend time with your family. Oh....he said he burned off a lot of that aggression at the gym. He lost 15 pounds and gain some feeling of control back. One of the worst things, he said, was feeling like everything was spinning out of control and he had no way to stop it. One-day-at-a-time is cliché, but it's true. Finding things to fill the time is essential.
Make a list of things you can control and one of things you can't control. Work on the "cans" and learn to recognize the "can't" roads when you cross them...don't take the turn, even if the road looks good.
As for "friends" with no manners, just learn to smile, nod, and change the subject. BTW....your daughter sounds like a gem. :-)
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AnneB
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 09/21/05
Posts: 3645
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I am not trying to discredit you, but some of the comments which certainly SOUND (and that is my perception as well as that of several other people) less than sympathetic to people in this plight. If humor about impossible legislation helps us laugh and momentary thoughts of revenge are healing, then who is someone else to say everyone is wrong when that person is no longer healing because they have moved on and remarried.
Your less than subtle attempts to criticize Kim would not be helpful to most females I know--therefore I was pointing out that there are some who characterize other's behavior as revenge but find another rationalization for their own.
Maybe it is just your perception I was trying to discredit your comments--after all that is what you said about LadyBugRN when she was upset. And, I will have to admit, the biggest jerk, not my ex, that I have ever known in my entire life used that expression ALL the time--?No, I am not being rude (arrogant, uncaring--pick your adjective). You just perceive it that way. No one is rude to you except in your own mind because you allow it." And I happen to think that kind of comment is used to excuse all kinds of bad behavior in the perpetrator's eyes.
That may not apply to you, because I don't know you. But I do know that you were implying Kim was wrong to feel revenge and everyone else who posted thought the same thing. Funny how we all had the same perception. I will always be sympathetic to people on here who are hurting because it is a recovery board--not a tough love board. There are probably enough of those people in their real life!
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kav
old hand
Reged: 06/10/05
Posts: 816
Loc: NC
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Thanks Anne
I did enjoy the revenge, or maybe I can say it was some form of justice for me. My stbx certainly isn't sitting back worry about how I feel, if I'm surviving or do I need anything. He moved on and is quite happy. Now his girlfriend has a Christmas gift idea for him ;)
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Yesterday I dared to struggle. Today I dare to win.
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ginni
addict
Reged: 06/06/05
Posts: 478
Loc: second star to the right and s...
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and stop trying to "handle" it, and start living through it.
Trust me Geoff...if there were an easy way to divorce...someone would be a millionaire.
What I mean by let it go is...if you were in a rodeo ring...with a big bull charging toward you...your first instinct would not to be to grab it by the horns and hold it until it was under control.
Instead...you'd get out of the way and let whatever was happening in the ring take it's course while you made sure you were okay.
This divorce is going to be whatever it's going to be...but you don't have to be anything but Geoff in the midst of it.
Find YOUR center...and let her go buck wild. If she's shacking up with a nineteen year old kid...what more can you say? She's not okay...and you trying to make sense of a nonsensical situation isn't going to propel you forward. Instead...it's going to hold you stagnant, even throw you in reverse.
Step outside the ring. Take an inventory. Make decisions for just you (that will include your children). Make your chart...and start checking off your accomplishments.
HONEST TO GOODNESS...if I had had a checklist in the beginning...it would have had things like: Opened Eyes. Took Shower. Brushed Teeth. Combed Hair. Ate THREE meals...and *I* am the one who divorced. *I* didn't want to be married anymore...but *I* still went through hard times b/c of the choices I made.
One of my all time favorite recovery board quotes is, "Baby steps eventually get you around the world."
Hang in their boy! You're doin' fine.
Love always,
ginni
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Mommie? I love you more than bacon. AYL-01/20/2006
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EmC
veteran
Reged: 06/02/05
Posts: 1569
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because I think it is much different than when a woman catches her husband cheating (as I did). I was enraged and angry and had his stuff packed within three hours of finding them and never looked back.
But my husband had a different story. His ex-w cheated on him two years before the marriage ended. She left one Friday and didn't come back for several days. Left him with the kids and a "sorry, but you aren't good enough in the sack" letter. He said he barely ate, couldn't sleep and was literally in a panic during those days. And she came back, when her boyfriend informed her she was NOT moving in and it was fun while it lasted. He used her. She begged for forgiveness and they went to counseling. There was another affair that was more emotional (some kissing and so forth, no sex) that he didn't know about. And then came the third affair. It was such a blow to his ego, his self-esteem and his self-worth. This man was 60+ years old to her 25. He was icky, nasty. She trashed my husband's self-esteem and self-worth into nothing. He wasn't good in bed. He wasn't "big" enough. He didn't fulfill her.
But this time, when she came begging, he realized he was in love with being married and being family, but not with her. looking back, he doesn't know if he ever really loved her. But she represented everything he wanted and they dated in high school, so it seemed natural.
He threw himself into fighting for his kids. He went to three lawyers until one agreed that he should not be any less a parent to the kids than she is. They both needed to be equally involved and the kids should be with both equally was his stance. And during this time, he began to heal. He got into counseling and switched churches to a church that could be his and the kids. He wrote alot in a journal and he processed his anger, hurt and betrayal that he felt. And when we met, he realized that all the things his ex always told him about his inadequacies were simply not true. Her dissatisfaction was about her, not him.
With me, I made the choice that I would not play in the drama. when someone brought up my ex, I politely changed the subject, no matter how strong the urge was to rubberneck :) find one spot of happiness each day. For me, I got up and watched the sun rise each morning. It reassured me that life was moving on. It is something I still do each day.
Ask yourself this: If she called tomorrow and wanted to go back, could you really get over the hurt and distrust that has built? My husband says you can't. He says it always there and every time she was 10 minutes late, he wondered. And if she didn't answer her cellphone, he wondered. And they couldn't have a physical relationship because he was always wondering. That isn't a marriage.
Fight for what you really want...your son. They are not a package deal and you don't have to accept a sham of a marriage just to be a dad.
Good luck!
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Debi
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/03/05
Posts: 7135
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Who said I'm sane? Sometimes it's hard as hell to get up in the mornings. I do it for my kids. Even when I don't want to. My x has beaten me down so much in the past 6 months that I feel lower than when we got divorced 4 years ago.
You have to let it roll off your back. My SO is able to do that with his X. He can have a conversation with her get upset and forget it 15 minutes later. I wish I could do the same. I'm trying though. I think it gets better when you realize they only have as much power as you give them.
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