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leegirl
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Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers
      #230527 - 05/04/07 10:01 AM

Is one better than the other?

How did you come about your decision whether to stay at home or work?

Anyone felt guilty about working although you had the option to stay at home?

I was reading this article and I found it interesting.
http://backofthebook.ca/living/2007/03/part-time-ophanages-part-2-job-only.html

"Parents caring for their child shouldn't be the "ideal"; it should be expected and ordinary, and seen as one of the most important contributions they can make to that child's life."

"Most parents from two-parent families today do have a choice when it comes to parental care. They can try and talk themselves into believing they don't, but it really boils down to priorities."

"Often, it's a matter of money and career goals having more value and importance than they should. Sometimes, people get so accustomed to a certain standard of living that they are unwilling to simplify their lives, live on less, in order to be their child's parent. Adding to the quandary for women is their desire to achieve career status and equality in a work world dominated by men. Ambition, in itself, is an unremarkable facet of being human. But add a child to the equation, and work and motherhood quickly become incompatible."

This is an issue that has become closer to home with me now since I am still considering the options and I remember a particular poster saying why am I having a child if I am going to have a nanny take care of him. So very rude I thought. Anyhow, I would love to hear some points of views on the subject.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230535 - 05/04/07 10:20 AM

My ex was a drunk. I was the one with the stable income, the retirement, the health insurance. Someone had to pay the bills and put food on the table on a regular basis.

At one point the ex wanted me to quit my job and be a SAHM. It wasn't that he thought it would be better for the famliy, it was because he felt I "held my paycheck hostage." It wasn't even considered!


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Witch23
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230537 - 05/04/07 10:21 AM

"Is one better than the other?"
-----> Absolutly not!!!

"How did you come about your decision whether to stay at home or work?"
-----> I have to financially. With DH's CS we could not live on his paycheck alone. I guess you could say I'm the breadwinner at this point.

I have a nanny (SIL) watching my D while I work. I do not see any thing wrong with child care. While I would have liked to stay home the 1st year, that was not an option for me. D will be going to a toddler program next school year.

I don't agree with the statement that most have a choice on staying home. With the cost of living going up faster than raises, and so many 2nd families and CS being due, I don't see how people could pull it off.

I agree with the statndard of living, I want to be able to live comfortably. But there is nothing I wouldn't do for my D.


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Debi
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230543 - 05/04/07 10:30 AM

When my third child was born I wanted to cut back to working part-time and my x had a fit saying we couldn't afford it. We could have, especially when you take into consideration what I'd have saved on gas, lunches, daycare, dry cleaning and other things I'm sure I'm forgetting.

At this point I don't have a choice. As a matter of fact if I don't find employment soon I'm going to be very worried. Not that it isn't illeagal but who is going to hire a woman who is 5 months pregnant? I guess this is one time when being over weight is a good thing. I'm not really showing yet so it's not obvious.

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Avaya
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Witch23]
      #230544 - 05/04/07 10:30 AM

I'm a working mother but if I had it to do over again, I'd trade my lifestyle to be a SAHM in a heartbeat! I work now to afford the lifestyle we've become accustomed to, but I know families larger than ours who live on much less than my husband makes so I know we could do it. But by the time I came to that conclusion, I figured that by the time we could get out from under the notes for the large home and nice vehicles and other extras we want but don't need, then it wouldn't matter to our son whether I was home or not.

It's really sad that when you need to be home, you can't afford to, and by the time you can afford to, you don't need to.

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sassyisme
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Avaya]
      #230549 - 05/04/07 10:38 AM

I guess I do both. I run stables on my land. I board 70 to 100 horses at a time. It is my business solely because I had it when my husband and I get married and will have it if, God forbid, we should ever divorce. I have 12 workers so when I need to do something else, be somewhere else, I can. I am here when the kids get home from school and I am here when they leave for school. We spend most of the weekend at the stables, as my children love to ride. But, I still have my own income and can support myself and my children, if need be.

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onerose
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230553 - 05/04/07 10:44 AM


There is nothing wrong with being a SAHM or a working mom.

I have always had to work so SAHM was not really an option.

I felt guilty a few times about not being able to be with my kids 24/7. But that passes.

In this day and age, I would be leary of being a SAHP. Mainly, because I would not want to be out of the work force very long, and then try to play catch up in my old age.


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elliesmom
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Avaya]
      #230556 - 05/04/07 10:55 AM

Whether one is better than the other - I think depends on the person. For us, I felt that it made little sense to have someone less educated than myself teaching my child during her formative years. Not that I am going to make her an engineer at 3, but I have chosen to educate myself on how children learn and employ the methods that I think will work best for a child like mine. I want my children to start out with the best that I can give them, which for me was not a daycare. I can be patient with her, I have the time and money (even without a job) to have enrolled in various social activities as well as learning activities outside our home. I don't think everyone is cut out for that or has the spouse that can/wants to support it. DH does't come home with the attitude of "I worked all day the kids are your job." He is always happy to spend the evening entertaining and caring for Ellie, which some days I really need.

I think if for any reason it can't be a positive thing - that daycare can be a better option. I have seen plenty of ill-equipped parents slapping their bratty screaming kids in the supermarket. Or with them throwing food in restaurants. I see the stupid choices they make that sets them up for failure and then when they fail they take it out on the kids (as if any idiot can't see that caving on letting your kid walk instead of riding in the cart isn't going to be a disaster). The kids have zero structure or discipline because the parent doesn't have the stomach for it or what have you. These people I don't think are serving their kids by staying home.

For us - it was a downturn in our lifestyle, but really - not as much as one would think. The money we save by me not commuting, not needing work clothes, cooking instead of pre-made foods has made it virtually impossible to really even notice. Being able to nurse exclusively saved us a bundle on formula as did using cloth diapers and making my own baby food. My husband (who is a sociology guy) did the math and figured out that the second spouse needs to make 36k a year to make it worth it to work outside the home if they have two children under school age.

I think the important thing is to be able to view staying home as a job where you work for your family. You work to save your family money (bargain hunting with a 1 year old is work I assure you), to clean their home, to prepare their meals, to teach your children how to behave and how to take care of themselves, etc. If you have that kind of self-discipline - it can be a great thing.

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KatyLee
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230559 - 05/04/07 11:02 AM

I have alot of mixed opinions on this one. I have been a SAHM for over 10 years. I love it! However I do have a home based business that I have had for 9 years. There is no way possible for me to get a full time job and make the money that I do now. However, I have often felt guilty about not having a "career". I've tossed around going back to school or going to get a part-time job. But nothing seems to fit my lifestyle. I don't have to call a boss if one of my kids are sick. I don't have to choose to go into work or leave the kiddos home. I have a teenager and she has gotten her first job. I get to drive her back and forth and spend alot of time with her. In fact my D's 10 & 9 are going to visit their Dad this weekend. I kept them at home today to spend some time with them and get them ready to go. If I worked outside the home I could never do that. Money does get tight sometimes however, I don't feel the need to spend extra money on the girls to make up for time lost with them. I figure when they are grown women they will not even remember they didn't have clothes from the best stores or a new car to drive every couple of years. They will remember hanging out with mom, dancing in the livingroom, and waking up in the middle of the night to eat cereal. I can also pick up on the drop of a hat in the summers and take off for the week to go visit family members. The girls have asked before why I don't have a real job. Then I let them know how long I would be gone everyday and they alwasy choose for me to be home.

Some days I think I would like the adult conversations that I'm sure I miss out on. Maybe my life would have been different if I chose to have a career. I don't know. What I know is I love my job at home and I love being here when the kids get off the bus. Some things a person just can't ever replace.
~Katy
PS.....Of course right this minute they are both having a fit cause I'm on the computer. This is REAL fun having 2 little girls stand behind me "Mmmmoooommmmm.......hurry up I NEEEDDDDD YOU"!! LOL......Gotta love it.....:)


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: onerose]
      #230562 - 05/04/07 11:11 AM

I love being here to go to my kids' field trips, field days, etc.... I am free to pick up at the drop of a hat and go to their school and help when teachers need it. I love being here when they get off the bus, except when they come home with the "Ihat ethe world" attitude. LOL. But, even that doesnt usually last long. There are still alot of things I would miss out on with them if I worked. I am glad I dont have to.
Like Katy, sometimes I would like more adult company than I get, but it isnt too bad.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230567 - 05/04/07 11:24 AM

I have today off from work and I am crawling the walls. I don't know if I could do it 7 days a week. There is no one to talk to but you guys :). I have no reason to get out of my sweats, so I look like a hag...and I STILL have to do the laundry, and pick the kid up after school....AND since both husband and son know I have today off, they will want a decent dinner...Grrr...

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jeffnjaclyn
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230570 - 05/04/07 11:28 AM

"Is one better than the other?"

I don't think that one is better than the other. I choose to be with my daughter, but all families are different. It isn't that parents who work don't care b/c I know they do. My husband says that he wants our kids to have more than he did, and I agree with him. It really depends on how many extras you want (internet, cable, phone, vacations) and how much each can provide for the family.

"How did you come about your decision whether to stay at home or work?"

It was easy. I worked at an NYSE company for over two years, and was moved up three positions in that time. I was young and they were able to mold me into what they needed, and would be needing, in the future. They had it all laid out for me. When my daughter got sick at the beginning of Dec. they made the decision for me when they told me it was her or them. I have no regrets.

"Anyone felt guilty about working although you had the option to stay at home?"

At times, when I did work, I did feel quilty b/c I wanted to be with my kids, but at that time they did get all those "extras" and that kept them occupied. Now I keep them occupied, and they don't complain about it or about not having everything that they had before.


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preemiemom
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230571 - 05/04/07 11:30 AM

KatyLee and LeeGirl:

KatyLee first, just because I am nosy and curious. What do you do for a home-based business? I ask b/c I would give my left arm to start one that I thought would be successful.

LeeGirl:

I was a SAHM very briefly (4.5 months)after "A" came home from the NICU. I absolutely LOVED being home with her. I did work on the weekends full-time. And I also loved what I did (I was managing a real-estate office). Soooo much more relaxing/less stressful than the corporate/climb the ladder environment I was in and had to go back to.

However, staying at home now, as a single mom whose stbx can't afford child support, is out of the question. However, I really want to start making some better "life choices". Like picking jobs that will make me happy, and not just taking the first thing that comes up b/c of the $$$ aspect (I know, I have this job I'm waiting for.. but it's not the "first job".. it was actually one of about 6 I was going for between last June and August... this company I'm waiting for now was my #2 choice out of the 6... my #1 choice actually called last week too; however, they want me to relo to Florida for 6 months and I can't do that, so they're off the list).

I'm hoping for a better work/life balance. I'm also looking to do more for me as a person, to make me feel better about who I am and where I'm going. So that even if I can't be with her as a SAHM, perhaps I'll show her the positives of a strong female role model?

I got the crucial time to me though.. those first few months she was home. She always knows my voice, becomes speed racer in crawl mode when I pick her up from daycare at night, and sometimes she even recognizes my footsteps. I had a stranger at Lenscrafters the other day comment "wow, you must really work with her alot". To which I replied "why would you say that"? (not in a BAD way, I was just curious what about her and my interaction would make her voice the observation.. and the phrasing "work with her". She said "it's just obvious.. how connected she is to you, how bonded.. you can just tell you've spent a great deal of time and attention with her".

Probably one of the nicest things anyone has ever said to me. Even though I'm not a SAHM, I still try to make the time we have together quality time for us both. I worry every day if I'm doing a good job, doing the right things, making the right decisions, and terrified of falling flat on my face and having her fall flat next to me.


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matart1
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230580 - 05/04/07 11:46 AM

I was a working mom then did stay at ome for 4 years .

I loved the 4 years I was home with my chldren but it was terrible to try to get back into the work force and frankly not worth it to some degree because I can still be just as involved even with the job I have with the kids in school and my work is family oriented enough to alot for it.
but I'm missng 4 years of additional savings for retirement and placing additional money into the children's savings that is hard to make up.

there is pros and cons for both.

but if a person is so completely foolish to rely on just one person's income for the long haul then I call it foolish and not pulling your fair share either.
I jus don't feel that my husband should be our only provider.

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BeckaLeigh
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LOL nrv [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230590 - 05/04/07 11:58 AM

I went crazy the first year or so. I had worked from the tim eI was 16 til I was about 24 or 25. Then, all of a sudden, I was at home. Yuck. I still have days where I cant stand to look at the kitchen mop. :) DH doesnt want me to but I was seriously thinking about going to work pt. But, now that I have the baby, I cant until it is figured out what is going to happen to him. But, I still have all of my animals and stuff too, so it isnt too bad. We live out in the country, so I enjoy it now.

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I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.


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Avaya
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: matart1]
      #230594 - 05/04/07 12:01 PM

I think that SAHM's do their fair share and I don't think that bringing home a paycheck constitutes being the sole provider. I think that SAHM's CAN provide a HAVEN for their families at home, can provide some neat community services, and can in general add to the family experience and I think that is an awesome contribution. She can create a place that hubby is EAGER to come home to each day, she can present herself as a well rested wife and mother without the outside worries a job brings, she can be at the beck and call of her family's needs (and I don't mean being pushed around - when you have a servant's heart, you do WANT to do those things for your family because you WANT to not because you HAVE to). But we do live in a society where marriage is disposable, which makes it harder for women to rely on men comfortably. Used to, a woman knew her husband was going to take care of the family because that was important to him. Women are more independent today, which IMO, in turn has made men loose sight of 'taking care of the family' and caused them to look elsewhere to 'take care of things', which has turned into a viscious cycle of men needing to take care of women, women not needing to be taken care of and just causing a lot of gender confusion IMO.

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KatyLee
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: matart1]
      #230599 - 05/04/07 12:06 PM

I completey agree with depending on one persons income. I got burned and it's been hard being left with all the reposiblities of the household. However there are always ways to make it. I am very fortunate that I am able to still be home after the divorce and I didn't need to go find a full time job. I also think it matters on what part of the country a person lives in. I'm in Texas and I know the cost of living is much less here than on the East coast or the West. In fact I had my first D in California and I knew right away I was not going to raise her there. I came back here and have been able to be a SAHM.
~Katy


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PhoenixRising
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: matart1]
      #230600 - 05/04/07 12:08 PM

“But if a person is so completely foolish to rely on just one person's income for the long haul then I call it foolish”

I agree w/ you although “naïve” might be a better word.

Jaclyn says that it is okay for her to be a SAHM because “divorce isn’t an option.”

Okay, lets not even start w/ all the problems conjured by that statement and leave it at face value. Even if two people stay married, shyt happens. Disasters, illness, catastrophes happen.

A very good friend, SAHM has a child that became very ill and nearly died. The good news is that a treatment was found and it looks like the child will make it. The bad news is the insurance company deemed the treatment “experimental” and they are denying payment. Their bills are over $500k and they are only halfway through.

My friend was like Jaclyn. An up and comer. She worked w/ in the financial markets; she chose to stay home the last 10 years. If she had stayed working, her potential salary at this point could probably pay off that debt in one year. She (like me) never thought about the fact that “choosing” to be a SAHP is a huge gamble.

I was/am a SAHM for the last 13+ years. Yes, as Becka said. I loved it. I loved being first to hear their soliloquies of their day.

HOWEVER, looking back, it was naïve and stupid. I have risked my family’s financial future because I selfishly wanted to stay home and make play dough with my kids instead of being a responsible adult and looking out for them, financially.

To not maintain or not gain marketable skills for the “just in case” scenario is not just foolish. It is irresponsible.


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elliesmom
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: PhoenixRising]
      #230609 - 05/04/07 12:13 PM

I couldn't agree more. My mother wanted to be a SAHM and got the shaft when my parents divorced. I watched what happened to her (and thereby me) after the divorce. I swore I'd never be there. That's why I don't see my education as a waste - even if I never use it again. There are other things - besides divorce - that can happen that make working necessary. My husband could be paralyzed in an accident tomorrow - then what? It would irresponsible to bring kids into the world without a backup plan.

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KatyLee
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: PhoenixRising]
      #230612 - 05/04/07 12:15 PM

I don't think you made a selfish stupid decision. You decided to stay home based on the facts as you knew them at the time. If that was the case then I was stupid and selfish to have married my X. I thought he was a good hard working family man. I was attracted to him partly because of that reason. Stupid and selfish can be viewed either way. You can also be stupid and selfish to go to work "Just" to be able to afford the good things in life.
Don't be so hard on yourself.
~Katy


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RJ1
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230615 - 05/04/07 12:23 PM

Children bond to their parents not to their teachers or daycare workers. Parents are the ones who care for and love the children 24/7 no matter if they are working or not, not their caregivers during the day. Children are not dummies...they know who their family is. So when someone says they don't want someone else "raising" their children I say it's not the way that works. They go to school at age 5 and are with teachers all day long anyway.

I work and always have and always will. I decided to have a career when I was 15 years old. I stuck with it and I've achieved my goals in 26 years. There is not a man, woman, or child that could make me quit to stay home. It's not a matter of money, it's a matter of how hard I worked to be what I am and the college and the studying and the hard work that it took...WAY before I even THOUGHT of having children. And my child gains a lot from knowing how hard I worked and still work. He sees the determination every single morning while we are getting ready to leave for work and school. I say it's good for him not bad.

And if I decide to take a "mom day" and not go into work, he basically gets his underwear in a wad. He WANTS me to go in. His philosophy is if he has to go to school then I should have to go to work. So not all children get this notion of calmness, cool breezes, and happiness just from a parent staying at home.

If I DID stay at home I'd be fat, a TV junkie, never get dressed or put makeup on, I'd be comatose by the time he got home from school, and probably stay ill as a hornet from no adult interaction. I probably get more done by working than I would by staying at home. And I STILL go on field trips and work at the school, I still parent him every single day just like SAHPs do. I may stay up later but it's all the same to me. Actually my son loves after school care. Daycares are not these evil, murderer-making places that people think. There are a lot of advantages I see in my son from attending daycare and the teachers he has now sees it too.

JMO.

RJ


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Debbie_L
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: RJ1]
      #230622 - 05/04/07 12:37 PM

"If I DID stay at home I'd be fat, a TV junkie, never get dressed or put makeup on, I'd be comatose by the time he got home from school, and probably stay ill as a hornet from no adult interaction."

Why? I stayed home when my daughter was little and I was none of those things. I rarely ever even turned on the TV during the day (believe me there's nothing on worth watching). I always made sure I looked nice and kept up my exercise.

I started working full time again once she was in school full time. I do miss those years of being there with her, and I'm so glad I did it.


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Avaya
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: RJ1]
      #230623 - 05/04/07 12:37 PM

I don't necessarily think SAHM's really 'stay home'. LOL They are very busy moms! I think the one's who stay home and turn into slobs are just lazy to begin with and wouldn't be much better in the workforce.

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PhoenixRising
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: elliesmom]
      #230625 - 05/04/07 12:44 PM

EM,
It is aprapoe that you responded to my post. I was actually thinking of you as I wrote it. You had mentioned in a previous thread what an upheaval it caused when the CS check was late because your family was so dependent on it.

My children are re-living your childhood. Being dependent on someone else and having no control over my financial life is stressful and demoralizing. I graduate in December and I will never relinquish financial control over my life again.

KL,
Thank you but I was not young and stupid when I had my kids. I was almost 40 w/ the 1st and over 40 w/ the 2nd. At some point, one is supposed to gain wisdom and foresight. I was criminally naïve.

There is no defense for SAHP. Changes summed it up:
“to have ANY kid you better have a boatload of cash. USDA said having a kid in the year 2002 would cost approx 250 grand to raise on avg to age 18<no college expenses>. So my feeling is that unless you can confidently walk into a bank and get a 18 year loan for a quarter million bucks without putting up any collateral<unless you plan to let'em repo the kid>.....then you're not in a financial position to.”


The irony is we had a lot more than $250k in the checking account before the legal fees ate it all up..


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youngatheart
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230627 - 05/04/07 12:49 PM

I SAH with my kiddos, and have never regretted it. I did try going back to work at one point, and it was the most miserable experience for all of us. I truly believe that is why my son struggles as much as he does now because he didn't get the guidance/time/structure that daughter got those first two years.

I have yet to find a daycare in the state of Oklahoma (minus one, which is WAY too far out of the way, and only accepts kids who are at least two years old AND FULLY potty trained) that is even semi-decent.


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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Debbie_L]
      #230628 - 05/04/07 12:52 PM

I am none of those things either Debbie, but I don't think everyone can do that. Just like not everyone is cut out for being a Doctor or an accountant, not everyone is cut out to be a SAHP. And I don't think anyone should apologize for that. If anything they are to be commended for recognizing the best way for them to serve their family is in the workforce. Just as quality SAHP's should be commended for making the sacrifices for them to serve their families in the best way they possibly can.

I think we were able to do that we could really benefit society by winnowing out the people who should NOT be staying home and raising undisciplined hellions for some overworked public school teacher to teach even the most basic skills on how to function in society.

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Debbie_L
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: elliesmom]
      #230631 - 05/04/07 01:02 PM

I don't think that anyone should apologize for not being a sahp either. I don't think it is fair to say a stay at home parent will sit on their arse and get fat watching tv while their brain melts out of their ears either. If the poster isn't like that at their outside job, I was questioning why they would be like that as a sahp. I couldn't care less which choice they made, I was just wondering why the extreme opinion of the sahp lifestyle (which they obviously have never had).

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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: youngatheart]
      #230634 - 05/04/07 01:08 PM

YAH,

Yes, after we elect EM king, one of her first acts should be to provide high-quality daycare for all.

I believe the reason many moms choose to stay home is that daycare is such a insurmountable issue.

I have a neighbor who is 25yrs younger than me and actually likes running around and wrestling w/ rug rats; she is a SAHM w/ a little one. She has no life so she is always available to watch my kids not only for after school but for all the last minute emergencies in my life. She use to work up at their school, does homework w/ them, takes them sledding (I don’t mind not being the one that is wet, cold and miserable pulling the sled up the hill for the 100th time). She takes them to the beach. She always has something going at her house.

I rush home from my classes like a mad woman, feeling guilty; only to find they are not ready to leave yet.

I think that if most moms knew their kids would be safe, happy and would thrive; they wouldn’t be so hesitant to keep a toe in the corporate world…


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rschiller
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: elliesmom]
      #230635 - 05/04/07 01:09 PM

Well said Ellie's mom. I am obviously a teacher. I have been teaching for twenty five years. When my oldest was born I took family leave and stayed home for his first year. I went wacko.

There is nothing else I have ever wanted to do besides teach. I am lucky because I make an OK salary now after 25 years and have gotten to spend lots of time with my kids despite working full time.

I posted in a different thread about how I can't understand how someone could never in their life hold a job even after attending two types of higher education. (college and cosmotology school) To spend all that money on an education and then never even use what you have.........have no children at home, and are not involved in anything productive. I would go stark raving mad, but that is me.


I still think women should enter the work force when their children enter school full time. My parents taught me that you must be able to take care of yourself. They said, "You could be happily married and he could dump you, die, or he could end up disabled, no telling really". They also knew that sometimes you can get yourself into a situation such as I did with a bad marriage, someone who abuses you, and that if you were not self supporting then you couldn't get out either.

I am so lucky they made me see that I should never depend on someone else to take care of my family. Some might say daycare is having someone else raise your kids, but well, mine are turning out pretty good and have no complaints. I think they are very well rounded having been around other children more and getting more experiences. They always knew who was mummy and who was daddy.


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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Debbie_L]
      #230636 - 05/04/07 01:12 PM

You misunderstood me. I am not dissing SAHPs. I'm saying that "me myself and I" would be that way if I stayed home. I need to get out into the world and have OTHER interactions besides just being a mother to be happy. You are right...that's all I know. Even though I did stay home 3 months after his birth...I got fat and watched way too much TV so I do know a little bit about how I would act and what I would become. I get bored at home. I could only wash so many toilets and clothes before I would get extremely bored. Heck I do all of that AND work fulltime. I need to manage people, feel productive in the workforce, along with being a busy parent to feel good about myself. I do not have it in me to go from a mover and a shaker at work and home...to just home and being a mother.

It just comes down to whatever is best for your family. Me working is best for us (besides I am a single parent and the sole breadwinner in my home).

RJ


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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Debbie_L]
      #230639 - 05/04/07 01:16 PM

"If I DID stay at home I'd be fat, a TV junkie, never get dressed or put makeup on, I'd be comatose by the time he got home from school, and probably stay ill as a hornet from no adult interaction."

Why? I stayed home when my daughter was little and I was none of those things. I rarely ever even turned on the TV during the day (believe me there's nothing on worth watching). I always made sure I looked nice and kept up my exercise.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I think the point she was trying to make was that if SHE were to stay at home all day, SHE would turn into this. Not that everyone who stays home is like that.

This made me laugh because it is so me. I am just killing time until my at home best buddy Jerry Springer comes on in 45 minutes. I have already made pizza rolls for lunch, and have the Snickers bar chilling for afterwards. Half of me is currently wearing pajamas, while the other half is in sweats.

Were I to be at work today, I would have been in a business suit with heels and hose, and be eating bananas and apples. Some of us just don't have the self control to be at home all day by ourselves. :)


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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230643 - 05/04/07 01:20 PM

"Often, it's a matter of money and career goals having more value and importance than they should. Sometimes, people get so accustomed to a certain standard of living that they are unwilling to simplify their lives, live on less, in order to be their child's parent."

---> I agree. I know that if we hadn't move to that "better" house in that "better" neighborhood that the ex thought we HAD to have to "better" reflect his new position...that our marriage would have survived. Instead, everything went to hell because the "extra" money we had before...that paid for "luxaries", that enable us to hire a sitter for US...was spent just to survive to the next paycheck.

---> JUST because you earn XX amount of money, doesn't mean that you HAVE to spend it all. You kid isn't going to die if they don't have the latest fashions or cell phone or MP3 player; they don't need to have a PS3 or XBox 360 or a television and DVD player or Internet access in their room. How many hours a day do you spend with your child...during the week...during the weekends? How many "activities" are your kids involved in? When was the last time ya'll had "fun" with your kids? How much more time could you spend with your kids if you weren't trying to "make up" for what YOU didn't have?

"Adding to the quandary for women is their desire to achieve career status and equality in a work world dominated by men. Ambition, in itself, is an unremarkable facet of being human. But add a child to the equation, and work and motherhood quickly become incompatible."

---> It's not a specific gender issue...how many fathers would be willing to give up their "careers" and be a SAHP if NOT for "society"? The MAN is SUPPOSED to be the "breadwinner"...he's SUPPOSED to support HIS family, he's SUPPOSED to have "drive" and "ambition", a REAL man would NOT let a women support him and so on and so forth.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230644 - 05/04/07 01:23 PM

To the poster who said that if you were lazy at home, you would no doubt be lazy at work...That is not true.

Even though I am a lump today, I have already completed all of the laundry and dishes. I am highly productive at work. I wouldn't have reached the level I am at had I not been. The two have nothing in common. That would be like saying those workers who are lousy at work, are also that way at home.


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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230646 - 05/04/07 01:26 PM

I would love to be a SAHM. If we could afford it I would do it in a heartbeat. But We love the finer things in life, 2 vacations a year, a home, boat, ATVs...I could never give those up. But, I think my kids would love to have me at home full time.

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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230647 - 05/04/07 01:28 PM

There is nothing wrong with being lazy at home when you have one day off. I was talking about women who stay home everyday and are lazy, (turning into lard butts), that's a lazy personality and has nothing to do with their lack of an outside job. And if their personality is to be lazy, they will be that way in a job as well.

Those of us who work, LOVE a day off while hubby is at work and kids are at school - and since we get that so little of the time, we DO tend to slop around some. Doing just what you said you're doing today - not dressed yet, but doing a dab of laundry, making the beds, emptying the dishwasher - taking 5 times longer than you normally would have on a work day.

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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230650 - 05/04/07 01:30 PM

[quote
This made me laugh because it is so me. I am just killing time until my at home best buddy Jerry Springer comes on in 45 minutes. I have already made pizza rolls for lunch, and have the Snickers bar chilling for afterwards. Half of me is currently wearing pajamas, while the other half is in sweats.

[/quote]

This is so me!!! :grin:

I love me days off during the week. No kids, McDonalds, Judge Judy...gotta love the stay at home life.


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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Avaya]
      #230654 - 05/04/07 01:34 PM

Avaya, I really think I could be a lump if I stayed home all day. I am not a lazy person by any means, but like the other poster, maybe we just don't have the self control to be active. My house is now completely clean. I would have nothing else to do for the day if I were a SAHP.

Yes I could go to the gym or the golf course, but that would require getting dressed. I have had full weeks off from work, and I wasn't a pretty site by the end of it. :)


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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: PhoenixRising]
      #230656 - 05/04/07 01:37 PM

My friend was like Jaclyn. An up and comer. She worked w/ in the financial markets; she chose to stay home the last 10 years. If she had stayed working, her potential salary at this point could probably pay off that debt in one year. She (like me) never thought about the fact that “choosing” to be a SAHP is a huge gamble.

---> "Could" is NO guarantee that her working would have changed anything. Right off the bat, you've got almost five years of full-time child care and that's a nice chunk of change, then five years of part-time/full-time child care which still isn't cheap. Then you have the natual inclination to raise your SOL when you income goes up...two-income family would have undoubtedly meant that they would have more living expenses and more bills. A "career" in the financial market is NO guarnatee that she would have been earning "big bucks"...market's flucuate, people change jobs, companies fold. And what about the child becoming so ill...I imagine there was a lot of care involved and whether it was care provided by the parents or professional care...you're talking a lot of money either for bills or lost wages. In fact, if my child was near death, either Dad or I would quit our jobs to take care of that child.

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sassyisme
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230657 - 05/04/07 01:39 PM

Just because only one has a job outside of the home doesnt mean you cant enjoy the finer things in life. It depends on alot of variables, where you live, your income, your bills, and alot of other things.

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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230661 - 05/04/07 01:51 PM

Who says you can't have it. We had two kids, I was a SAHP and yet ex and I played golf every Sunday. We had a snug little 3-bdrm, 1 1/2 bath house and two cars that were paid for.

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Debbie_L
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: sassyisme]
      #230662 - 05/04/07 01:52 PM

"To the poster who said that if you were lazy at home, you would no doubt be lazy at work...That is not true."

That isn't what I said at all. I said why would they think that's how they would be at home if that's not how they are outside of the home. I felt it was a legitimate question. I have been both (sahp and a full time working single mother). I know both roles very well. I certainly never felt myself becoming lazy, ignoring my appearance, etc when I stayed home, so I was wondering why the poster assumed that would be the case. She has since clarified her position and indeed does feel that is how she would be. I wasn't that way at all. Now I work full time and still try to do many of the things I used to do, but I must admit the housework, cooking, etc does suffer to some degree at times. I tend to be playing catch-up alot on the weekends. I need a wife, lol.


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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Gecko]
      #230663 - 05/04/07 01:56 PM

[quote]Who says you can't have it. We had two kids, I was a SAHP and yet ex and I played golf every Sunday. We had a snug little 3-bdrm, 1 1/2 bath house and two cars that were paid for. [/quote]

We could not have all these things if I did not work. This is just my situation.


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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: sassyisme]
      #230667 - 05/04/07 01:57 PM

[quote]Just because only one has a job outside of the home doesnt mean you cant enjoy the finer things in life. It depends on alot of variables, where you live, your income, your bills, and alot of other things. [/quote]

My family would not have the finer things in life if I was not working. This is my situation.


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230674 - 05/04/07 02:11 PM

Ok, you put it like families with SAHP's live in shacks and feed their kids only bread and water. We take vacations, have a boat, 2 cars, a home, wont have ATV's as none of the kids are old enough, including DH, and several other things. We dont do without. And the kids have good, home cooked meals every night. I dont see why the SAHP's would bash the WOHP's or vice versa. It is a choice each of us makes. For better or worse. Most of us are well-educated, loving people.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230676 - 05/04/07 02:12 PM

A lot also depends on the part of the Country you live in. Our biggest expense is the house. If I were to sell it and move to the midwest, I would be able to basically buy something free and clear that was 5 times bigger than what I have.

That is why you have so many folks leaving California and moving elsewhere. My husband and I plan to do the same thing when we retire. Where I live you need two incomes just to break even. Even the doctor's and lawyer's wives aren't staying at home...:)


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230679 - 05/04/07 02:15 PM

Goodness. Didnt realize it was that expensive just to move closer to the water. ;) Seriously, we live on one income in Texas and do darn good.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230681 - 05/04/07 02:18 PM

Two bedroom CONDOS in my area are selling for close to $500,000. Double that for a house. As for water...no where in sight...:)

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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230694 - 05/04/07 02:33 PM

OMG!!!! I am looking at a 4 bedroom house, on 5 acres, for less than $75,000. Around $150,000 after financing. My gosh. I couldnt do that cuz I wont live in a condo. I just feel trapped.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230702 - 05/04/07 02:45 PM

You mentioned elsewhere you were buying a place, but I didn't want to ask and get ill with you telling me the cost.

Hmmm....Texas is starting to look REALLY good!

Edited by nrvouswrk (05/04/07 02:46 PM)


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Gecko
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230703 - 05/04/07 02:45 PM

in my area

---> But what about OTHER areas?

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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230711 - 05/04/07 02:54 PM

LOL. I cant see paying that much for a place. No wonder you guys think I am crazy for staying home, instead of working. LMAO. Our bills a month arent but a little over a $1000 and that is including a rent note of 500. Our note on this place will be less than that, depending on how long we finance it for. Texas summers are a witch tho.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Gecko]
      #230712 - 05/04/07 02:54 PM

I was talking about my area. Where I live is a bit closer to the highend mark. Even in other parts, it is up there. The next county from me WAS a bit lower. The problem is that everyone works in my county because the wages are higher.

Los Angeles county is on the other side, and is WAY up there. You can find parts that are cheaper, but in high crime areas.

Then you have the commute if you live in an outlying area. If the drive doesn't kill you, the price of gas will. I just paid $3.69 a gallon this morning.


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230714 - 05/04/07 02:56 PM

Whoo girl. I paid $2.67 a gallon yesterday. Only costs me $37 to fill my Rodeo up.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230716 - 05/04/07 02:59 PM

Whoo girl. I paid $2.67 a gallon yesterday. Only costs me $37 to fill my Rodeo up.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

STOP!!! You're killing me! First the house, now the gas...What's left to torture me with?

Texas, here I come...:)


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230720 - 05/04/07 03:09 PM

Hmmm, well, I can gripe about the meat prices. Hamburger, the good kind 93/7 is like $2.59 a lb. Round tip steaks are $4.67. THAT almost scared me out of the grocery store Monday.

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nrvouswrk
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230746 - 05/04/07 03:27 PM

Well then I won't tell you what we pay for steaks...You would be able to buy the whole cow at your prices.

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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230749 - 05/04/07 03:30 PM

[quote]Ok, you put it like families with SAHP's live in shacks and feed their kids only bread and water. We take vacations, have a boat, 2 cars, a home, wont have ATV's as none of the kids are old enough, including DH, and several other things. We dont do without. And the kids have good, home cooked meals every night. I dont see why the SAHP's would bash the WOHP's or vice versa. It is a choice each of us makes. For better or worse. Most of us are well-educated, loving people. [/quote]

I guess living at home means you can't read. I said IN MY SITUATION my family could not have the finer things in life if I did not work. Understand now???


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KrazyKat
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230750 - 05/04/07 03:30 PM

What part of Texas are you from? I'm from Tx and all my family is still there. (Only DD and I moved to New England)

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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230751 - 05/04/07 03:31 PM

We are looking at buying a lot on one of the lakes in Texas for retirement. Most of the lakes are for residential use now. $59,000 for 5 acres...not bad!

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Loc: Texas
Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230752 - 05/04/07 03:32 PM

DH and landlord talked about raising some cattle and slaughtering them at the landlord's slaughter house together but there is no way, how much I could save, that I could raise an animal and then eat it. Yuck.
How can everything else here be so much cheaper except for the meat WE raise here?????

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I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.


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onerose
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230757 - 05/04/07 03:35 PM


I live in TX too. And we are looking at buying land also. We are looking for about 5 acres on a lake too. Strange. But we can't find any for that cheap. Not on any lakes.


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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: onerose]
      #230766 - 05/04/07 03:40 PM

go to http://www.private-communities.org/

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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230768 - 05/04/07 03:42 PM

http://www.lakehouse.com/

or

http://www.horseshoebayland.com/


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230772 - 05/04/07 03:43 PM

**I would love to be a SAHM. If we could afford it I would do it in a heartbeat. But We love the finer things in life, 2 vacations a year, a home, boat, ATVs...I could never give those up.**


You wrote that. Never in there did you put IN YOUR SITUATION!! The way most people READ, which is one of those skills I had my first grader teach me, they would have taken it like that, too. Comprehension, too.

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I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230773 - 05/04/07 03:46 PM

That's not bad at all. Which lake, if I may ask? Lake Conroe is about 45 minutes away from us. It is great. Do you live in Texas?

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I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: onerose]
      #230778 - 05/04/07 03:48 PM

I havent either. Not saying it isnt possible, just saying I have looked all over and cant find that good of a deal on the lake. Maybe I just dont know where to look. Most of the ones I have seen dont even have much acreage with them.

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I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.


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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230780 - 05/04/07 03:48 PM

[quote][quote]Just because only one has a job outside of the home doesnt mean you cant enjoy the finer things in life. It depends on alot of variables, where you live, your income, your bills, and alot of other things. [/quote]

>>>>>My family would not have the finer things in life if I was not working. This is my situation. [/quote]

Pay attention hunny.


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onerose
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: BeckaLeigh]
      #230784 - 05/04/07 03:51 PM

THANKS! Those are great! Yea, we live in the Houston area and want to get further away. Getting to crowded. Actually Conroe is one place we are looking at.

Edit to add... We need the land, cause I wanna horse!

Edited by onerose (05/04/07 03:53 PM)


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BeckaLeigh
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230785 - 05/04/07 03:53 PM

Why are you taking everything so serious? Nobody is saying it is a bad decision to be a WOHM. Actually, in most cases here, people think we SAHM's are naive or stupid.

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I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.


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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: onerose]
      #230787 - 05/04/07 03:56 PM

Rose - We are thinking of flying out there from Nevada at the end of this Summer. Horseshoe Bay will pay our transportation and lodging if we check out their community.

We pay no state taxes in Nevada and I know Texas is the same. I would love to spend everyday on the lake fishing and boating.


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onerose
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: joym525]
      #230789 - 05/04/07 03:58 PM

ME TOO!! Thanks again, I am going to look at all the sites you gave me, this evening.

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Avaya
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: nrvouswrk]
      #230794 - 05/04/07 04:00 PM

[quote]Well then I won't tell you what we pay for steaks...You would be able to buy the whole cow at your prices. [/quote]

Ooh, ooh, my husband recently bought a 'whole ribeye' and paid $45 for it. We got 27 one inch steaks out of that thing! He said the cost ended up being $2.94 per pound!!!!! I was thrilled! Here a ribeye (which is the only steak we buy) is usually $7.99 per pound. When they go on sale for $5.99 I go buy a few. When they go on sale for $4.99 a pound, I stock up my freezer!!!

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joym525
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: Avaya]
      #230797 - 05/04/07 04:02 PM

I received a mailer for Trump (Donald Trump) steaks...$199 for 4 steaks..I kid you not. I could not believe it.

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supermansdaisy
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #230900 - 05/04/07 06:58 PM

I am lucky, because I am a hospice nurse who takes weekend call. I have to be available Friday evening through Monday morning. I have my "base" at home, and occasionally go in to the office. I get fulltime pay for this position. Only drawback....I only get 2 weekends off a YEAR.

I have worked full-time during the week, and also stayed at home. They all have pros and cons. The kids really hated afterschool daycare, which always made me feel guilty.

We all just keep living one day at a time and do what we think is the best for us!!


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KatyLee
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: supermansdaisy]
      #230944 - 05/04/07 08:14 PM

I live in Texas.....tiny town right outside of San Antonio. Actually SAHM's are not at all uncommon here. In fact most of my frineds stay at home. We do have alot of Californians moving to our town. Sell the house in Ca. buy one here with a couple of acres free and clear. I built my house 5 years ago. 4 br, 2 bth, 2 acres...... Not a mansion by any means, but cute and quaint. I'd never want to live any where else than Texas.
~Katy


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Gecko
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: supermansdaisy]
      #231058 - 05/04/07 09:52 PM

I am a hospice nurse who takes weekend call.

---> Just want to say thank you for being there. I recently lost my father and had Hospice in...there were wonderful people. Again...thank you.

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focusedon2
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #231067 - 05/04/07 10:01 PM

I think the ideal situation, for me, would be a work at home Mom or, in other words, self-employed.

That is how I started off. I made a great deal of money working PT at home. That's when technology was flying.

But I was there to have breakfast and lunch with my daughter. I took her to the park, the doctors, etc. whenever I wanted to. If I wanted to work from midnight to 2, that was fine.

Now I have a job where I have no vacation time and it really hurts. My children are getting used to it but I hate it when they are off from school and I am shuttling them here or there and I can't spend time with them. I feel like I am "owned" by a company and I dare not complain or we'll starve.

I envy those who are self-employed.

I enjoyed being a SAHM. I loved spending time with my kids. I loved teaching them the things I wanted them to know. I loved being able to build relationships with other SAHMs and their children. Those relationships have lasted 8 years.

Since I have started to work, it has been so hard to meet other mothers and their children. This is especially true because my children do not go to school in the neighborhood.

However, I would never stop working again. It was way too painful when my husband - who told me I was a "woman's libber" if I wanted to leave my children in daycare - later threw in my face that I had nothing to offer him and that this lawyer that he was screwing, who drove a Lexus, who owned property in MA and HI, had so much more to offer. So much more that he could have a child with her and it wasn't going to take a dime away from the kids we already had.

Right.

Sure he was tripping and apologized but I haven't forgotten and will never really forgive.

Financial independence is my goal - for myself and for my daughters. If my daughters can be financially independent and able to be at home with their children when they are young - that's ideal. Don't know if it's possible but I will do whatever I can to help them get to that point.


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Runswithscissors
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Re: Stay at Home vs Work Outside Home Mothers [Re: leegirl]
      #231450 - 05/05/07 11:03 PM

I would LOVE to be a stay at home mother and applaud that that can...... however, due to my CS obligation- that is never an option for me.... so I tiry to what is best for us... I "work" out of my home.

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