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gr8Dad
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OT-HR 347, Protest restriction bill...
      #783714 - 04/24/12 08:35 PM

BOTH parties passed it, Obama signed it, and there was little to no fanfare or notice.

"‘‘§ 1752. Restricted building or grounds
‘‘(a) Whoever—
‘‘(1) knowingly enters or remains in any restricted building
or grounds without lawful authority to do so;
‘‘(2) knowingly, and with intent to impede or disrupt the
orderly conduct of Government business or official functions,
engages in disorderly or disruptive conduct in, or within such
proximity to, any restricted building or grounds when, or so
that, such conduct, in fact, impedes or disrupts the orderly
conduct of Government business or official functions;
‘‘(3) knowingly, and with the intent to impede or disrupt
the orderly conduct of Government business or official functions,
obstructs or impedes ingress or egress to or from any restricted
building or grounds; or
‘‘(4) knowingly engages in any act of physical violence
against any person or property in any restricted building or
grounds;
or attempts or conspires to do so, shall be punished as provided
in subsection (b).
‘‘(b) The punishment for a violation of subsection (a) is—
‘‘(1) a fine under this title or imprisonment for not more
than 10 years, or both, if—
‘‘(A) the person, during and in relation to the offense,
uses or carries a deadly or dangerous weapon or firearm;
or
‘‘(B) the offense results in significant bodily injury as
defined by section 2118(e)(3); and
‘‘(2) a fine under this title or imprisonment for not more
than one year, or both, in any other case.
‘‘(c) In this section—
H. R. 347—2
‘‘(1) the term ‘restricted buildings or grounds’ means any
posted, cordoned off, or otherwise restricted area—
‘‘(A) of the White House or its grounds, or the Vice
President’s official residence or its grounds;
‘‘(B) of a building or grounds where the President or
other person protected by the Secret Service is or will
be temporarily visiting; or
‘‘(C) of a building or grounds so restricted in conjunction
with an event designated as a special event of national
significance; and
‘‘(2) the term ‘other person protected by the Secret Service’
means any person whom the United States Secret Service is
authorized to protect under section 3056 of this title or by
Presidential memorandum, when such person has not declined
such protection.’’.

So, essentially, they can say, "This area is off limits to protest", and you can be jailed for a FELONY if you go there. Are we REALLY willing to let them have this much control?

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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...


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googledad
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Re: OT-HR 347, Protest restriction bill... [Re: gr8Dad]
      #783731 - 04/25/12 07:50 AM

Why not , you thought it was great when ole GW was arresting demonstrators left & right .

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Maury
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Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: googledad]
      #783734 - 04/25/12 10:39 AM

It does not restrict orderly protests in proper locations. It restricts such protests (and violence) in restricted areas. Free speech is allowed, but it has always had limitations.

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gr8Dad
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Re: OT-HR 347, Protest restriction bill... [Re: googledad]
      #783739 - 04/25/12 01:14 PM

Hey, BOTH parties passed this, this is NOT a partisan issue.

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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...


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gr8Dad
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: Maury]
      #783740 - 04/25/12 01:15 PM

"It does not restrict orderly protests in proper locations."

No, but it DOES allow them to define "proper areas" without any oversight. In other words, theoretically, they could say, "Okay, for a five miles radius, this is a no pretest zone." And tada, they can now arrest anyone protesting.

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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...


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Maury
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: gr8Dad]
      #783748 - 04/25/12 04:33 PM

There is always oversight. If it appears that the law is being used to overly constrain legitimate speech, it can be challenged as overbroad in its application where the standard of review is likely to be strict scrutiny.

That is generally how the process would work for any restrictions on speech.


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Gecko
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: Maury]
      #783749 - 04/25/12 04:36 PM

If it appears that the law is being used to overly constrain legitimate speech, it can be challenged as overbroad in its application where the standard of review is likely to be strict scrutiny.

---> Such as the law that was passed that prohibited teachers from have FB contact with minors.

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gr8Dad
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: Maury]
      #783750 - 04/25/12 04:39 PM

"If it appears that the law is being used to overly constrain legitimate speech, it can be challenged as overbroad in its application where the standard of review is likely to be strict scrutiny."

See, THAT is the problem. We have to come to the mentality that if a LAW is wrong, we can look at it LATER. When in reality, it is during the DISCUSSION phase that such things should be discussed. Because once it is a LAW, during the time it is being challenged, those suffering under the law will continue to suffer, because it is still in effect.

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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...


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Maury
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: gr8Dad]
      #783751 - 04/25/12 06:01 PM

The law, as written, is not wrong. Constraining speech to proper venues has always been a legitimate government interest. However, it must be narrowly tailored to a significant government interest and use the least restrictive alternative.

It is only when the application of the otherwise valid law oversteps constitutional bounds - it is challenged in a judicial forum.


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gr8Dad
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: Maury]
      #783752 - 04/25/12 06:06 PM

How can this law NOT overstep its bounds? The law gives the PEOPLE BEING PROTESTED AGAINST, the ability to determine WHERE the protestors may not protest, regardless of whether it is a public or private location.

This is UNPRECEDENTED power, and it is also absolute. We all know what absolute power does. But at a MINIMUM, it removes a person's RIGHT to be in a PUBLIC place and to protest, unless the person or thing they are protesting AGREES with letting them there. This is a DANGEROUS law.

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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...


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Redlegg
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: gr8Dad]
      #783753 - 04/25/12 06:26 PM

The law is fine with me for the most part. It is not a free speech issue. There are already laws, free speech zones, protest areas, and all these thing exist in one way or another. The only problem I have is this:

‘‘(B) of a building or grounds where the President or
other person protected by the Secret Service is or will
be temporarily visiting; or

That creates a rolling zone, where someone has a permit to protest, legally, granted by any authority, and it is immediately overruled, because someone with SS prortection comes around. It could be used to stifle any opposition at a speech. It could also be used during a campaign to stifle protest at an imcumbent's speech, when a challenger is not protected by this law. Free speech does have it's limitations, but this law can insulate certain officials from seeing any dissent, and it may be seen as an obstacle to the right to petition the government.


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gr8Dad
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: Redlegg]
      #783755 - 04/25/12 06:41 PM

No, the scary part is right here:

"of a building or grounds so restricted in conjunction
with an event designated as a special event of national
significance"

So, they can define ANYWHERE as somewhere under their control, and say YOU can't protest here. Think of this, you live across the street from a school. The French Premere is visiting the school (and is, naturally, protected by the Secret Service). You have a sign on YOUR lawn protesting something the French are doing. The Secret Service declares the area around the school as a no protest zone...you are now a FELON. Of course, you can FIGHT it, but the way this law is written, you have ZERO defense, because there is no mechanism in place to deter them from declaring it a "no protest" zone, they solely make the decision, and therefore you are guilty.

Of course, NOTHING like that would ever happen, right? Not until it does.

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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...


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Redlegg
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: gr8Dad]
      #783756 - 04/25/12 06:53 PM

They already do that. Pick any national event, and it becomes restricted. There is no problem with that. Watch the party conventions, they always designate specific areas for protesting, so these things do not get interrupted, people get escorted out of government buildings. Yes, even private property comes under scrutiny during these times. To me the problem is the SS protection, and the fact that having protection puts this into effect. It is more of the unscheduled type thing, like the Secretary of State walking through an airport, suddenly there is no protest bubble that the Secret service gets to determine. Very vague, very mobile, and no advance warning.....There are definitely issues to me. If that did happen with a sign in the yard, then yes, definitely an issue, but it is not so much about free speech, because that is not absolute, as to whenever, or wherever you want to say what have to say.

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gr8Dad
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: Redlegg]
      #783757 - 04/25/12 06:58 PM

But there are mechanism's in place to make sure that the protestors are reasonably close to the event (because lets be honest, protesting outside of the view of the person or group being protested is stupid). This law will end that.

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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...


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gr8Dad
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: gr8Dad]
      #783764 - 04/25/12 11:50 PM

Damn, what does it take to get good debate started around here again?

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Why give a "senior" discount, they have had plenty of time to raise the money...


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SweetLight
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: gr8Dad]
      #783812 - 04/27/12 01:10 AM

"Damn, what does it take to get good debate started around here again? "

----->Well, since the select few have it all figured out, the rest decided it was best to sit back and watch. :-)


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SRS
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: gr8Dad]
      #783819 - 04/27/12 08:53 AM

ahhh.....we are afraid to debate after the JL and her stalker friends fiasco.

Piss someone off by your comments here and they do some creepy stuff.


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LeAnne
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: SRS]
      #783820 - 04/27/12 09:09 AM

Not to mention being accused of something that you didn't do....plus dealing with Liars...what is the point?

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SRS
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LeAnne]
      #783822 - 04/27/12 09:38 AM

I have you on ignore, Leanne, - and I don't peek. I will always believe you are Longroad or one of the others.

You were too strong in your defense of your little buddy plus it is amazing that you posted right after me today, isn't it?

I won't reply to you again, but I thought I would let you know why.


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LexieBelle
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: SRS]
      #783823 - 04/27/12 09:41 AM

Amazing isn't it? Not a peep out of the bytch since JL got outted as her own stalker BUT, magically? She appears to post because YOU posted? Unfreakingbelievable. Falsely accused? I highly doubt it. I'm with you, I totally believe Leanne is one of JL's "troll" crew.

Things were so nice and quiet.. until one of the troublemakers has to pop back up. Too bad. Even JL has the good sense to stay away, or at least shut up. Leanne obviously doesn't even come up to her intelligence level, which is pretty pathetic.


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cutiepie
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LexieBelle]
      #783824 - 04/27/12 09:50 AM

get help

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LeAnne
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: SRS]
      #783825 - 04/27/12 09:56 AM

So still won't admit you have others from here on your FB?

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LeAnne
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: cutiepie]
      #783826 - 04/27/12 10:04 AM

There is no cure yet...haven't seen anything on brain tranplants?

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cutiepie
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LeAnne]
      #783828 - 04/27/12 10:30 AM

Ha ha :)

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LeAnne
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LeAnne]
      #783829 - 04/27/12 10:44 AM

I would like to Thank all my Detective Troll group friends. The old info pointed out to me has been quite interesting to say the least.
People who have been busted being trolls, but then call trolls...Hmmm? Now we are talking back in 2008, but still?
Then it was pointed out, that Lb wants to arrest all drug users, fine or jail them, but then a PM came through that showed, she said they should all be legal?

I know they do make meds for Bi-Polar.

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Empty Nesting


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cutiepie
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LeAnne]
      #783831 - 04/27/12 10:57 AM

You should also thank the same group of friends that passed your name and shop name around

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LeAnne
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: cutiepie]
      #783832 - 04/27/12 11:12 AM

Free Advertising..Cool

Hmm, I wonder if I gave them my Ex's name, if they can find out anything...he owes me close to 80,000

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cutiepie
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LeAnne]
      #783833 - 04/27/12 11:17 AM

Nothing about your ex. Just your name, how do you pronounce that? Some pics of you and your shop name.

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LeAnne
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: cutiepie]
      #783834 - 04/27/12 11:30 AM

Dang no pics of the cool lobby I have? I did the tile work myself. None of the cool customer crapper either?

Hope it was a picture that made me look younger? I did dye my hair last weekend, had to cover up those 5 silver things poking out. But only 5, I will take that at almost 50.

Did they have a pic of my HOT Hubby and his curly locks? Hubba Hubba

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Empty Nesting


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cutiepie
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LeAnne]
      #783835 - 04/27/12 11:36 AM

Yes. Like the saying goes...There is someone for everyone. I did picture you to look different. For some reason I thought you were taller and leaner.

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cutiepie
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: cutiepie]
      #783837 - 04/27/12 11:38 AM

if your hair was a little longer you would like a short fat troll.

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LeAnne
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: cutiepie]
      #783839 - 04/27/12 11:46 AM

5 foot 8 inches is short? Yes put on a few pounds sitting behind this desk, but at least it didn't go to my butt. Some gut, but hey my boobs got bigger too. That damn menopause.

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cutiepie
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LeAnne]
      #783840 - 04/27/12 11:51 AM

No it went to your face. By the looks of your body size, one has to conclude that you have been sitting behind the desk for many years.

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LeAnne
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: cutiepie]
      #783847 - 04/27/12 12:31 PM

The face is inherited, family trait. Anyway you have a great weekend, I get to leave early today. Have to finish things for a party for 108 people this evening.

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mewanda
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: cutiepie]
      #783852 - 04/27/12 01:00 PM

Get help. You seem jealous and stalkerish. Creepy.

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M5M5
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LexieBelle]
      #783883 - 04/27/12 04:36 PM

Um? I'm not taking up for anyone here, but SRS is the one that brought it up first. She is trying to stir up the drama again...I mean, why even mention it? If you are going to come out and bust LeAnne's chops in this thread for "daring to show up"...may want to do the same to your friend SRS for stirring it up. JS.

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Sampoe
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: M5M5]
      #783898 - 04/27/12 10:19 PM

For God's sake M5M5 and/or Jennifer, please drop your troll name "MEWANDA". All are onto you both, go away!

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LexieBelle
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: M5M5]
      #783902 - 04/27/12 11:28 PM

Why? She made a PERFECTLY VALID POINT!!! Perhaps if someone didn't feel guilty, she wouldn't have protested so much? Don't know. But SRS didn't say anything untrue, and she only named JL which is a FACT she was her own "stalker". Fact. She's 100% correct, not a damn thing to call her out for.

It is; however, fascinating, who chose to post, and what. Supposedly buhbye and VOILA! Choosing THAT specific post to just HAPPEN to reply to? Please. Mmmmhhmm. Yeahhhh, nothing jinky about THAT is there. And she posts and magically? The trolls reappear. Astonishing.

I'll tell you what. SRS? Has more common sense, and frankly character, than many here. We are not "friends", but I'd trust her opinion on a day to day life issue before yours ANY day. You lack common sense and savvy. You got played by JL, hook line and sinker even when led by the nose to realize she WAS lying. Yet you still defended her, blindly and stupidly. SRS? Had her pegged pretty early on. She's a smart, self-sufficient, self-supporting woman with a smart brain on her shoulders. She has 20 years on you and could run circles around you ANY day, ALL DAY.


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PamG
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LexieBelle]
      #783906 - 04/28/12 02:37 AM

Common sense to you is agreeing with you completely! Maybe others are sick to death of listening to how great you are and how others can do nothing right! You are not the worlds greatest mother! Your mother is not the worlds worst mother! Your daughter is not as great as you think! You are not correct on every single flipping thing you comment on. In fact you flip flop on so many things most people can't keep your opinions straight.

You talking about someones having more character is like Obama talking about running a transparent government! Both are HILARIOUS!!!!!!! :crazy:


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LexieBelle
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: PamG]
      #783908 - 04/28/12 05:29 AM

LOL. Someone needs to take a sleeping pill or something and CHILLAX!!!

35 posts since 2004 and one of those posts is this drivel?

:crazy!!:


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SRS
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LexieBelle]
      #783910 - 04/28/12 07:04 AM

Wow. Interesting turn on this thread. Very telling.

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LexieBelle
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: SRS]
      #783915 - 04/28/12 08:14 AM

Isn't it? Very amusing really

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M5M5
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LexieBelle]
      #783928 - 04/28/12 03:50 PM

LOL ok. I guess we will agree to disagree here. SRS was trying to flame...at this point, y'all know what buttons to push to have the board go wild (amazing the trolls came out with SRS too). I'm not about to excuse anyone's behavior if they intend to flame. ANYONE. Sorry.

Your last paragraph? Is BS...pure and simple. You don't know what went on behind the scenes between me and JL....and if you go back...you can see where I stopped "defending her"...but you won't bother. I've defended others on here, and you like to lump all of them with JL. Whatever. You really need some professional help...you get too worked up over all this. God forbid someone doesn't agree with you or points out your HYPOCRISY...you start calling names and telling them how they lack savvy and common sense. Pot? Meet kettle.


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Treasure
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: LexieBelle]
      #783931 - 04/28/12 07:36 PM

[quote]Isn't it? Very amusing really [/quote]

Yes. Yes you are. Very very amusing. :D

I once told the board that putting their email on their profile was not a good idea as anyone would be able to get personal info very easily. I was called a stalker for pointing it out. You are crazy people for sure.

You, Dawn, are a horrible horrible person. So is Suzanne. Stirring the pot, then predictably blaming others for showing up. Yes, yes you are very amusing. I am entertained. Laughing really.


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mewanda
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Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: M5M5]
      #783935 - 04/28/12 07:54 PM

Sad you seem to care so much what these nutty women think yet you so easily drop friends for doing not even worse than what these nuts have done to them. This board is so filled up of back stabbers and hypocrites it's amusing. You people just can't stop can you.

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Treasure
journeyman
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Reged: 03/15/08
Posts: 80
Loc: Real Life
Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: mewanda]
      #783939 - 04/28/12 08:27 PM

They turn on each other constantly. Careful what you say, Dawn will regurgitate it months, even years, later to dig at you. Yet somehow she can't remember her own words well.

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SRS
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 11/05/10
Posts: 2434
Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: SRS]
      #783978 - 04/29/12 06:11 AM

[quote]ahhh.....we are afraid to debate after the JL and her stalker friends fiasco.

Piss someone off by your comments here and they do some creepy stuff. [/quote]

Need I say more? lol


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LexieBelle
Carpal \'Tunnel
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Reged: 11/07/10
Posts: 3688
Re: Nothing to Protest (You can in Orderly way) [Re: SRS]
      #783990 - 04/29/12 08:33 AM

Too funny! I get a really really good laugh out of it now I've noticed the regulars under fake names typically come out at night. Now whenever I see one of their posts all I hear is the song "the freaks come out at night, uh huh uhhuh.. the freaks come out at night... ". Brings me back to my clubbing days of the 80's. Love me some Whodini baby!!! So I really gotta thank them for keeping a tune I love running through my head :-).

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