preemiemom
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 01/17/07
Posts: 19391
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What is the legality of a contract, signed by one party on the deed to a property, but not BOTH?
I'm curious as to this because if a property is deeded to both spouses, and say a realtor allows the signing of a listing agreement but not BOTH owners signing? How could you stop one spouse or the other selling or otherwise disposing of a property without the other person's knowledge? (again, both spouses are on the deed as joint tenants in common, rights of survivorship.. whatever version it is that if one dies the property automatically goes to the other spouse, without having to go through probate).
Thanks!
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Spring
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/04
Posts: 7972
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Joint tenants is the one where the interest is undivided as you described...if one party dies, the other gains the undivided share. A listing agreement with two joint tenants as you described must be signed by both parties or it isn't valid. This may not apply to the rental contract you were asking about previously...did you get that solved?
If the owners are registered as tenants in common, the interest is divided and either party can sell their share without any consent of the other party.
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Never consider the possibility of failure; as long as you persist, you will be successful.
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preemiemom
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 01/17/07
Posts: 19391
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Hi Spring...
Naw.. didn't get that resolved. The guy is being a TOTAL jackarse about it. Has sent me 3 threatening emails in a week regarding payment. He's been sending his emails and copying a "legal" email address at his brokerage. When I tried to sent IT an email? Bounced back as non-existing.
I did post a question on a legal website, but couldn't get ALL the details in. Basically I screwed up in not putting my potential tenant ON the contract as an exclusion. However, I was holding a crying/sick 1 yr old on my lap the entire time and the guy was a hardcore "pitch man".
Anyway, he sent the invoice via regular mail, I got it a week ago Friday? Meanwhile, he sent the invoice on a Monday, 2 days after I said I wanted to pursue my own tenant. I didn't tell him they'd signed a lease or not. And he sent me an invoice.
So, I got the invoice... 12 days ago? He's emailing every 3 days demanding payment. Threatening me with lawsuits and liens. AND he refuses to return the key to my house.
I'm thoroughly annoyed. I got a packet to file a complaint with the local real estate licensing board. And I got the name of the owner of the agency itself (which was a HUGE problem.. the office girl refused to give it to me).
One of the lawyers who replied to me suggested offering him 1/2 as a quick settlement, but I have a feeling that he won't go for that, and then I'd be admitting liability.
I'd almost rather go to court and lose and then offer a compromise, or have a judge suggest a compromise and at least make this guy GO to court over it.
Anyway, just a big headache.. big mistake on my part. I was just tired, distracted and didn't read the darn fine print... but I also feel this guy took advantage of that too. He deliberately lied, knowing what the contract said, but didn't point it out either, which I feel is a deceptive practice????
Sorry...
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Spring
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/04
Posts: 7972
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If I were in your shoes, I would write him a letter advising him that you are disputing the invoice. Even though he is aware, it is good to do anyway. If you don't respond, that doesn't look as good in court.
The next thing I would do is write that complaint letter to the Real Estate Board.
From there, I would wait and see what he does. It seems awfully suspect that he is writing emails to a legal dept that doesn't seem to exists...could be that he's trying to intimidate you. It also seems a bit overkill to be hassling you every three days.
You have a right to dispute an invoice, so I would do it. I think I told you this before...but here, he would most certainly be held to your verbal agreement regardless of this so called disclaimer in his contract.
If you were to fight this out here in Small Claims, its probable that the judge would, at a minimum, go 50/50...if he doesn't just rule in your favor. There is an expected level of professionalism that the judges here impose on Realtors(and other professionals).
We just had a similar discussion about liability in my office again yesterday...we are liable here for what we say as well as what we write in a contract. There is little chance your guy would get away with that here. Having said all that...I could be liable for what I tell you as well...so I must include...."check with a Real Estate Lawyer to confirm any info I have given you for accuracy". Its always best to talk to a lawyer..especially since I am not familiar with the laws for your area. But if I were you...I'd let him take me to court :-)
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Never consider the possibility of failure; as long as you persist, you will be successful.
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preemiemom
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 01/17/07
Posts: 19391
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Thanks Spring..
I did indeed send him an email disputing the invoice. I have the original email and the envelope with the postmark on it that it came in.
In all of this, the man doesn't have prove that I even rented the property at all. All I said to him was that I wanted to pursue my own prospect. I never confirmed that it was or wasn't rented.
I also left him a voicemail yesterday.
My next step is to write a letter to the owner of the agency itself with all my documentation and a timeline of events, and include copies of his emails (which will clearly inclue the fictitious "legal" email address, and yes, I totally think that was purely an intimidation tactic.. the man is ALSO very much aware that I'm recently a single mom, with an infant, so I think he's totally playing on what he thinks is my total vulnerability.. little does he know the ONLY career aspiration I've ever had is to be a criminal prosecutor, lol).
Anyway, I'll definately let it go to court. I agree, worst case in my mind is that judge would give me 50/50 split of the invoice.
I am in New York, by the way.. forgot where you were from?
And again, thank you very very much! (and I won't hold you to anything, I promise.. but do appreciate your insights, greatly greatly greatly!!!!!)
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Spring
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/04
Posts: 7972
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I hope the jerk gets at least a reprimand from his licensing body!! That kind of stuff just bugs the heck outta me!!
I'm in Canada, so I have zero first hand knowledge of the laws for your area...but I'm glad to help if I can.
I hope you win at least something in all of this:-) Please let me know how it works out for you.
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Never consider the possibility of failure; as long as you persist, you will be successful.
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preemiemom
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 01/17/07
Posts: 19391
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Thanks, I definately will! I think it's totally bizarre that after mailing, snail mail, an invoice postmarked on February 22nd, that he's giving me til tomorrow, March 7th to have him RECEIVE payment (not even MAIL it, receive it), otherwise he's "got the legal paperwork ready to go".
I've never heard of anyone threatening legal action LESS than two weeks from sending someone an invoice. Actually his first threat of legal action was 4 days after I'd received it on February 26th.
We'll see how the letter to the owner goes first ;) (who is a woman, by the way, lol.. not that that means anything, but I still think her feminine sensibilities might be offended nonetheless)
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NancyD
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 06/03/05
Posts: 2105
Loc: New York
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Preemiemom...there was just a news article about a realty [censored] in Queens that has been ripping people off for a while now...approaching people, offering to sell their house (when they didn't even have it on the market), then buying it themselves for a low-ball figure, and turning around and twisting the owners to buy a more expensive home they have in their stock, then selling the original home for much more than they paid. It's a real rip-off because they also have a mortgage broker in cahoots with them getting the buyers mortgages with low-payments, but they end up being things like "interest-only" or adjustables with short adjustment periods. After a short while in the new house, the families find they can't afford the new place and some have lost it back to the realtor (because the realtor ended up holding the mortgage). Total, total rip-off.
Sounds like your realtor went to the same school of illegal and hardball techniques.
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