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Reged: 10/28/04
Posts: 436
Loc: The "Sunshine" State
How do you prove Parental Alienation?
      #226799 - 04/26/07 08:50 AM

If I recall, someone was doing research in reference to Parental Alienation?

-What type of proof do you need?
-Are judges starting to accept Parent Alienation more?
-How extensive is the counseling on the proof required? (Meaning.. what type of counselor can prove the allegation of Parent Alientation?)
-Does anyone have experience with trying to prove parental alienation in reference to a "substantial change in cirumstances?"

-Remarriage is an excellent test of just how amicable your divorce was- Margo Kaufman

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Carpal \'Tunnel

Reged: 09/30/05
Posts: 4197
Re: How do you prove Parental Alienation? [Re: BlendedFamily]
      #226954 - 04/26/07 01:28 PM

I think it depends on the court and the actual judge. We brought in emails that were really nasty from my husband's ex refusing visitation, showing she wasn't truthful about not having our addresses (not only did she have ours, but she had all of my family members in the local area as contacts), and ex's refusal to anwser my husband's basic questions on how the kids were doing and cooperate with medical and other issues (none of his business). The judge threw out the mediation report as it was clearly bias and he was being bullied into no contact and gave him a reasonable visitation schedule (which now she will not follow and there is no point in filing contempt as she still will not follow it). But, it just depends on the judge and if they are reasonable and support the other parent's involvement. The judge we got was very reasonable.

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Reged: 10/28/04
Posts: 436
Loc: The "Sunshine" State
Re: How do you prove Parental Alienation? [Re: jsp]
      #226970 - 04/26/07 01:46 PM

Here's another question:

If an individual informed their attorney that Parental Alienation was going on in an ongoing custody modification but the facts were not true... It makes me wonder if the attorney just wants the money or just doesn't want to tell the client he/she is wrong?

Wouldn't you need more than an accusation of Parental Alienation in order for any type of custody to change hands? Just statements of.. I am not getting my visitation and I am not being informed of any medical problems or education with regards to the children.

You would have to have written proof and hardcore facts in reference to those allegations right?

-Remarriage is an excellent test of just how amicable your divorce was- Margo Kaufman

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Carpal \'Tunnel

Reged: 01/05/07
Posts: 3681
Loc: New York
Re: How do you prove Parental Alienation? [Re: BlendedFamily]
      #226977 - 04/26/07 02:14 PM

In the 1980’s especially in California, a guy by the name of Gardner coined the term: "parental alienation syndrome" (PAS) to describe cases of “intense rejection of a parent by children after divorce”. He describes these children as "obsessed with hatred of a parent."

PAS was born and was used successfully in its limited scope to overturn custody.

I am pretty sure from what little I know of your background that this doesn’t fit your situation at all.

This is not the same as plain old “parental alienation” which is what jsp was talking about. This mostly comes up in contempt motions as most COs have a statement pertaining to “no parent will say not nice things about the other parent”.

It is generally proven with letters, emails, and testimony. My ex got on the stand and agreed that he only says bad things about me. He justified it by saying that everything he says it true (in his reality) and one should always tell the truth to children (he could be a long-lost relative of Susan’s).

Anyway, he was told to take more parenting classes (he never took them) and that was the end of that.

She is wasting her money. Custody won’t be overturned because ex’z can’t talk nice to each other in front of their children.

And before anyone jumps on me; I am NOT saying it is right or wrong; just explaining that there is no LEGAL basis.

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Reged: 03/14/07
Posts: 443
Re: How do you prove Parental Alienation? [Re: PhoenixRising]
      #227053 - 04/26/07 05:51 PM

You are absolutely correct, PhoenixRising. We had the situation occur from the beginning. He would tell us he wanted nothing to do with us, and would refuse to come with us; however, my husband always made sure he came (except for the first two times, and we went to the police station to make a report). Then when we spoke to an attorney, he advised us that PAS (there are 3 forms of PAS) is hard to prove, and most judges don't consider it as a change, or even look at it from that view b/c it is a "new" syndrome.

Although we knew this, we still adv Jeff's ex that we would use it against her if she didn't stop coercing behaviors from him. She still doesn't know it can't be used, but we have to use any measure we can b/c she is pretty evil.

I also think that if a parent is alienating a child, then there will also be other factors that will come into play to assist in the long run with a custody battle.

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Reged: 04/25/07
Posts: 658
Loc: SC
Re: How do you prove Parental Alienation? [Re: BlendedFamily]
      #227401 - 04/27/07 12:21 PM

I have a question of my own....How do you counteract the Parental Alienation? I have 2 boys, ages 7 and 10. Their father and SM have been using some form of PA for 5 years now. The youngest was 2 at the time of the separation, so I consider him to be most susceptible. When their father and BM made them call SM "Mom" when they married 6 wks after the divorce, I about died. They call me "Mama". They undermine all of our activities (swimming in the lake is gross and dirty, baseball games are boring, your birthday party for him is a "little" party...the REAL one is at our house, you are just "visiting" your mama; your real home is with us) constantly. I want to trust that the boys know in their hearts that I am their mom and I love them. I couldn't stand it if the brainwashing kicked in. Like I said, this started when the youngest was 2, so he doesn't know any better. How do I counter all that??? BYW...we share custody. 3 days a week with me and 4 with them.


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Reged: 04/27/07
Posts: 24
Re: How do you prove Parental Alienation? [Re: supermansdaisy]
      #227572 - 04/27/07 06:53 PM

I've been researching this for a few days now. Thank God for Alec Baldwin. If it weren't for him, my wife would not have seen this as a syndrome on the today show. Go to they have good resources and links elsewhere.

ON a personal note, my ex filed to remove my custody and visitation today since my house is a hostile environment. The battle begins.

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