Maury
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/04
Posts: 8146
Loc: This Asylum --->
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I really don't know why I ask this here given the petty crap that occurs, but I will anyway. Is there really any such thing as "some heart failure?" The atrial valves are leaky and not efficient. The result is retaining water in the ankles, sometime to the point of seeping water. New symptoms include pneumonia (fluid in the lungs). Recent symptoms includ bad oxygen flow. Poor color. Bad oxygen levels. High heart rate corrected by electrical shock. Now being treated with battery of exams for pnemonia among other issues.
To me it sounds like the biginning of a long process. Yes?
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spinnerdegrassi
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 08/20/06
Posts: 7956
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Yep, he's 3rd spacing and weeping. Get him a picc line for the Antibiotics, some diuretics assuming his creat level and BUN are WNL, and get his ass moving and not sitting in bed.
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Maury
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/04
Posts: 8146
Loc: This Asylum --->
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Thank you spinner for a post I can respond to. We have him moving. Got him a walker. The issue is his will.
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finz
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/17/08
Posts: 6462
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I'm assuming you mean his will to work at maximizing his health and not bequeathing his assets.....one is easy to manage (for an attorney), but the other....not so much.
Getting him moving AND loving life are critical factors in his prognosis. Unfortunately, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.
How old is he ? Is he still able to drive and get out of the house without assistance (when his lungs aren't full of crap)? Does he live in housing that accommodates some limited mobility (one floor, no laundry in the basement, etc) ? Would he look forward to outings of interest in the future ?
In my family, I've seen a mix of attitudes about maximizing good health. My husband or his brother HAVE to go tend to my fil's gutters the moment the leaves start falling or they'll find his 93 yo bony butt climbing the ladder himself. He'll be joining us on our big family camping trip to Saranac this summer unless my sil with stage 4 breast CA who just had another 2 surgeries this month for recurrent brain mets needs to stay local for treatment.
Compare that to my 75 yo mom who is nOT doing well after a knee replacement and revision, most likely because she won't do the prescribed exercises. My parent's 48 year marriage is going to h3<< over their bickering about her exercising. Dad has had back surgery and ankle issues after he was hit by a car when he was bike riding, but he's still out their walking every day and pays the price in pain when he bike rides, but still does it. He is going with the bribery approach.....if mom goes to her pool therapy 3 x week, he'll take her to Foxwoods in April.
This is your dad, right ? Is there anything that really interests him that could be used as bribery to help motivate him ? Like, if he's a train guy, a trip by old locomotive through the Canadian Rockies where he could use a walker, but would have to have the weeping edema under control or it would awfully inconvenient ? A trip is something to look foward to and his something he would want to be in his best shape to get the most enjoyment out of it.
Ultimately, if he can't get motivated, I would just caution you to try to accept him as he is. Encourage him and challenge him while their is still hope, but recognize that he has some choice in how he handles this. If his choices are not how you would do things, it's hard to stop pushing. If this is the beginning of his final journey, he may want support and not a constant bombardment of, "You'd feel better if you just did xyz."
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Maury
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/02/04
Posts: 8146
Loc: This Asylum --->
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"How old is he ?"
88
"Is he still able to drive and get out of the house without assistance (when his lungs aren't full of crap)?"
Not so much any more. Double bypass surgery 2 years ago. Two knees, two hips and one shoulder replaced over the years.
"Does he live in housing that accommodates some limited mobility (one floor, no laundry in the basement, etc) ? Would he look forward to outings of interest in the future ?"
No. Still in the same house where they have lived 50 years. Working on moving them but they are reluctant to move. He has gone to a couple Packer games, but it is getting difficult. he worries about incontinence among other things.
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LeAnne
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 08/18/05
Posts: 10232
Loc: missouri
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Sometimes it is hard to see that our parents are getting old. He has lived a Good Life. At 88 he has lived a long time, lot's of great memories I'm sure. If they are reluctant at moving, maybe it is time to find someone(nurse type maybe LPN) to stay with them. Seems they pay more attention and don't give the worker a hard time, like a relative. They sound quite a bit like my parents(mine are only 70), lived at the same place(HOME) for 40+ years. Sometimes I think moving them, sorta doesn't help them. Some elderly seem to want to stay home, in their regular surroundings if at all possible.
Just my opinion Maury, you have to do what works for everybody involved. But if his end in near, and he doesn't want to move, if you can make his wishes come true...I guess that is what it is all about in the end.
I have quite a few elderly customers and most don't want to go anywhere, they want to die at home.
Sorry you are having to deal with this...most all of us will face this or already have.
Prayers to your Family Maury.
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Empty Nesting
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Tweeby
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/05/04
Posts: 7100
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Sorry to hear that your Dad is not doing so well health wise. From what I have been told and what I have witnessed with family members, if they have lived in a home long term than when or if you move them their mental capabilites may deteriorate quickly. It is not as bad if the person has moved a lot over their life but living 40 years in one place is a long time.
No help with the medical, confused on a lot of what is happening to my Mom.
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finz
Carpal \'Tunnel
Reged: 06/17/08
Posts: 6462
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The reluctance to move is a tough one for some people. I'm a little opposite on that one.....I can't wait to get to my (future) one floor condo in Florida with a resort like pool specifically so I can be more independent. I'm also planning on being around for many more decades, so making adjustments to my living situation is a no-brainer. If your dad isn't anticipating a long future the stress of a move might not seem worth it. The sorrow of leaving a 'lifetime' home is difficult to manage even when you WANT to do it. If you feel forced because of finances or poor health, it's even more traumatic.
Regarding the incontinence issue.....that can be much easier to manage for men than women. Have you heard of a Texas catheter (also called a condom cath) ? Slides on like a condom and has a tube at one end that goes to a leg beg. It makes it a lot easier to navigate going out/socializing when you don't have to worry about accidents AND it can help decrease 'skipping' doses on needed diuretics, which a lot of people do to try to avoid accidents due to urinary frequency.
Does he have visiting nurses when he is home to check up on him ? MC doesn't cover ongoing visits for chronic illnesses anymore, but with current pneumonia and the frequency of his health crises, he should be eligible. VNA can also help evaluate if private care is needed to help manage the situation.
Does he have a good recliner chair ? He'll need to keep his legs up (above the level of his heart, so a chair with an ottoman doesn't really cut it) to keep the edema in check.
Does he have a wheelchair with leg extentions for when he goes out ? A hospital bed at home to raise the head of the bed to help with breathing and the foot of the bed for the edema ? The bathroom safety hit list with commode, safety rails, etc ?
Are you working with a social worker/discharge planner from the hospital to evaluate IF he will be safe at home ?
My mom's best friend, guessing about 75ish, was in reasonable health until December when her son took her Xmas shopping and accidentally backed into her with the car....she fell and broke her hip. Hospital, surgery, ehab for a month....and back home to her teeny tiny Cape style house with narrow steep stairways. Wasn't home 2 weeks when she fell down the stairs and broke her femur (leg bone just under the bolted in hip).
Of course everyone wants to live their lives on their own terms. That's normal. I wish you could dope slap them a bit that if they give in on some things, it will give them more control over everything else. Most people want a peaceful passing in their own bed....either surrounded by love ones if they KNOW it's coming or just not waking up one morning. You just can't get that if your in the hospital because you fell and broke something.
Sorry that you are dealing with this, but I am happy for your dad that he has at least one caring, intelligent person in his corner.
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