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#228304 - 05/11/07 12:28 AM No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants
4yroldmom Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 40
What do I do now? My almost 6 year old hasn't seen or spoken to his father since january first by his father's choice. "He was working at the beach" He called once in February to see him and didn't show up when I went to meet him. When I called him on it his "wife" called back and said he was still working at the beach and didn't know how he was supposed to see him. The next time my son was supposed to see him I asked him if he was going to show up at our meeting place and he hung up. He called back again a month later asking to talk to my son. My son called him back and he hung up on my son. He called back and said they were "disconnected". My son called him back again and he didn't answer. Now, he hasn't spoken or seen him in months so of course when I took him back for child support arrears that were supposed to be paid by December 15th and are now going back before the commissioner in June since he refused to pay he wants to see him. Last weekend I told him no, my weekend and already had plans and he hasn't seen him since January. He called back this week and said that he understood it's mother's day and if I had plans he would see him next week. When I called him back about only taking him for a few hours Saturday night after he got off work because he hasn't seen him since January he said no - taking my son to see Grandmother and would keep him until noon. I explained it was mother's day. He said he would be taking me and my husband to court already had the petition filled out. He said he would bring the cops to my house this weekend. I told him to go ahead i would not allow my son to go with him until the court made a decision then. Am I wrong? This has been happening over and over again since my son was a baby. I have sole custody and he is supposed to have visitation every other weekend 9am sat to 9am sun (which we agreed to when son was 6 months old).

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#228305 - 05/11/07 12:59 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
4yroldmom Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 40
Also, forgot to mention father does not have a license to drive. Suspended due to child support arrears according the Child Support Enforcement while we were at mediation for arrears. DCSE representative told him more than likely he was notified and he did not read the letter. He got defensive and said she didn't know that and that the court had not been sending things to the right address he moved out of state and didn't notify anyone except me of new address.

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#228306 - 05/11/07 01:56 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
mommy2boys Offline
addict

Registered: 06/02/05
Posts: 497
Loc: Louisiana
Tell him he can pick up son at 9am Sat, but he is to be returned by 9a on Sun just as the CO says. When he shows up well after 9a Sat, you don't have to let him take your son, especially if he is driving. IF he shows up by himself and threatens to call the police let him go ahead and do it, then mention to the police that the reason you won't allow him to take child is because the CO says 9am on Sat, and from what you understand his licenses is suspended and he isn't to be driving therefore you do not think it is appropriate for son to ride in the vehicle with him.

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#228307 - 05/11/07 02:08 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: mommy2boys]
4yroldmom Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 40
What if the police come with him and his wife and she is driving - do I have a right to say I think it is unsafe for him to take him because he has no license and there is no guarantee that he will not be driving even if he does have her there and because he hasn't seen son in over 5 months by his choice?

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#228308 - 05/11/07 02:18 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
4yroldmom Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 40
Also, I have seen some posts about certified letters - I'm thinking about sending this one "Mr >>>>>, Our current court order states that you are to see our son every other weekend sat 9 am to sun 9 am with alternating holidays and any changes to that schedule are to be discussed 48 hours in advance. As of this date you have missed x visitations without notice. As of 4/30 you were notified that your license has been suspended. Based on your voicemail on x/x because it was mother's day you agreed to change your weekend. I called with an alternative because you were working and to assist in helping you to get to know your son again. You have refused that alternative. I am respectfully requesting that you consider our son in this matter. You have not seen him in over 5 months - spending more than 24 hours with him all of a sudden could be stressful for him. I would like to have our order modified to supervised visitation and a state drop off/pick up location determined. Until we can come to a new agreement I am requesting that you follow the following schedule:

5/11 3:30 (when you are off of work) until 8 pm
5/26 2:30 until 8 pm
6/6 1:30 until 8 pm
x/x 12:30 until 8 pm
x/x 11:30 until 8 pm
x/x 10:30 until 8 pm
x/x 9:30 until 8 pm

This will assist in allowing our son to get you know you again before he spends a full weekend.

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#228309 - 05/11/07 02:32 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
mommy2boys Offline
addict

Registered: 06/02/05
Posts: 497
Loc: Louisiana
Legally you still have to let him go. But say he shows up at noon, your CO clearly states 9am, then no you don't have to let him go because X wasn't there at the specified time.

IF the wife is there and she is driving, the police will assume that she will be the one driving, since X doesn't have a licenses.

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#228310 - 05/11/07 02:32 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
BeckaLeigh Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 6879
Loc: Texas
I hate to say it and alot of people may disagree with me but I think you are mking a mountain out of a molehill. My kids havent seen grandparents or dad since Nov and they are going with them for part of the summer. IS there a particular reason why you dont want him to have him for the reg time?
_________________________
I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.

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#228311 - 05/11/07 02:34 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
BeckaLeigh Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 6879
Loc: Texas
NOPE!!!
_________________________
I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.

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#228312 - 05/11/07 02:36 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: mommy2boys]
BeckaLeigh Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 6879
Loc: Texas
Honestly, is there any other reason you dont want your son going with his dad? Do you have to stick to the CO to the letter because of prior incidents? Just wondering, dont want to say something without more background and be all wrong once again.
_________________________
I tried being normal once. Worst five minutes of my life.

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#228313 - 05/11/07 02:36 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
nrvouswrk Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/13/06
Posts: 2362
If he hasn't seen the kid for months, then why does he automatically get to start his EOW this weekend? Have you guys really been keeping tract of who has when since the divorce? If not, then this can be your weekend, and the next one his. Especially since this one is Mother's Day weekend.

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#228314 - 05/11/07 02:53 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: nrvouswrk]
4yroldmom Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 40
I have been keeping track since day one. he has never been good about seeing son and has only wanted to take him when he is going to receive money from his parents - it's like he is showing his son off so that they will help him. I feel like his inconsistancy is harmful to my son. We have a good life I work hard and have worked for the same place for 15 years. I am remarried and we do things as a family. I provide for him and carry his medical. I have never asked for anything except for his father to pay the very little child support he has been asked to pay and to follow his visitation order. 2 years ago he slammed the door in my face and said he never wanted to see son again, changed his mind after we went to court for child support. He did it again and when I filed modification request I ended up recinding request because emotionally it was taking a toll on my family. He was saying and doing things that just were not true and I had a new baby and didn't want to add anymore stress to the situation. He of course promised he would follow his visitation to the T, but has not. I am just wondering when is enough enough? Son is going to be 6 in August. I am harming my son by allowing this inconsistency to continue?

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#228315 - 05/11/07 02:55 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
mommy2boys Offline
addict

Registered: 06/02/05
Posts: 497
Loc: Louisiana
You can not change the schedule at a whim, you are court ordered to let son be with his father from 9a Sat to 9a on Sunday, until that is changed via court order you can not dictate when he will see your son. If he can't be there at 9am on Sat, then he doesn't get to see your son, unless oyu two can agree to something different. Children of divorce whose parents don't live in the same city, or state often times go for months without seeing the NCP, your sons father was obviously not in the area for a while, therefore he could not exercise his visitation as the schedule says. Stick to the schedule as it is court ordered, until it is changed legally. You might want to remind him if he takes son this weekend then you will have him on fathers day, that is just how it happens to work out on the calander.

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#228316 - 05/11/07 03:01 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
nrvouswrk Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 04/13/06
Posts: 2362
He sounds EXACTLY like my ex. What I learned is that there is nothing more frustrating to a control freak, than having nothing to control. So play along...

If he is anything like mine, the more you put up a fuss and he realizes he is getting to you, the more determined he will be.

Go along with the visitation without a fuss. I use to let the ex think that he was actually doing ME a favor by taking the kid. That way my husband and I could be alone and all lovey dovey. When he wants the kid, say "That is GREAT!!! I was hoping you would want to see him! Now I can go ....I didn't have a sitter, but this solves my problem!" He will cancel...

As for the CS, go for what he should be paying. That is for your child. Of course he won't be happy about it, but happiness is not one of life's entitlements.

You never want to get yourself into a pissing contest with a skunk! You have to be smarter than that...


Edited by nrvouswrk (05/11/07 03:02 AM)

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#228317 - 05/11/07 04:00 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: nrvouswrk]
4yroldmom Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 40
I really could kick myself at this point because if I would have just left the arrears go and the fact that he promised to pay by 12/15 then he probably would still be leaving us alone and there would be no worrying about what scene he is going to pull next. Seriously, I don't really need the money he is required to pay. It's just nice to get once in awhile so we can go to a special movie just my son and I or I can buy him those "new" clothes that he needs instead of continuing to wearing hand me downs. It's really really really hard to see him with my son. It's even harder when he convinces his mom to call me - the one who left me a message when we broke up telling me I should never have had my son. Oh yes I still have a copy of that tape from over 5 years ago. I will never forget that day, that was the day I knew she didn't care about her grandson. Then I learned the whole truth about what she did to her kids and why she felt the need to continue to supply her son with money so he didn't have to work or own up to his own responsibilities. She left her family behind with their father for someone else. She never paid child support and good lord if you asked her to spend a weekend with them that was torture. Now, however, married or not, working or not she will give him whatever he needs. How did I get involved with her just as crazy son????? Oh yes, I was VERY young and obviously not to smart. I learned not to trust him, after I found out I was pregnant, after some things he did like staying out all night, calls from ex girlfriends and taking money out of an account that I thought I had hidden from him. He was definately verbally abusive towards me but how do you prove that? I tried sooooooooo hard to make this amicable and I am just at my wits end now. I don't want my son to grow up thinking this is ok. The thought of my son acting like his dad does today makes me crazy. I can't sleep at night. I am very strict with him because I think it is important but my husband tells me I need to slow down and remember that he has a good family now to help him grow up regardless of the other environment. He is soooo confused when he comes home from the other place. If I do have to let him see his BF again I am definately going to take son to a counselor and I will definately work on going to counselor together for family session. I have never been afraid to ask for help when I need it and I just want to make sure I'm not doing anything to hurt my son.

Please don't hold any mispelled words against me - it is late here :)

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#228318 - 05/11/07 04:24 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
Rebecca5 Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 11697
Loc: Down home.
You can't choose to deny parenting time just based on his inconsistency. No, it doesn't feel "fair," but that's the way it works. There's rarely any consequence for a non-custodial parent who doesn't observe his/her parenting time....unless it's been a very long period of time with zero contact. Even under those circumstances, it's usually just a period of reunification before regular visitation is started again. The only person who can make that decision is a judge.

Maybe your ex does have lousy motives for wanting to spend time with your son, but that's not a call for you to make. The really crappy part is that denial of parenting time is grounds for a change in custody in many jurisdictions. If your ex can show a court that his job really has prevented him from being present for his other scheduled parenting times, it will reflect very poorly on you. There are many occupations that have that result.

Five months isn't that long of a period of time. I'm sure your son still knows his father, and would probably love to spend some time with him. You can have a huge impact on how well he adjusts to the absences.

If your ex were to return to court, there's a high probability that he will be awarded more parenting time. Twenty-four hours every 14 days is peanuts. So what you open yourself up to is having to deal with this issue even more often.

As long as the wife is driving, he's not breaking any laws. If Mother's Day is a big deal to you, I would offer the next weekend instead, for maybe a longer period of time...say Sat 9AM to Sunday at 6PM....or even this weekend, but for different hours....say Friday at 5PM to Saturday at 7PM....so you can still observe the holiday.

Either way....he's still your son's father, and still has a court order that has to be followed....even if it's only when he decides to show-up. Oh...and the police thing is an empty threat, unless he's specifically awarded this exact weekend by your CO....and even then, the most common result is that it's official documentation if/when he really decides to go to court.

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#228319 - 05/11/07 12:43 PM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
momx3 Offline
old hand

Registered: 04/19/06
Posts: 1036
I have always found that with these type of "fly by parents" that this "crisis" you're experiencing now is only temporary. As a previous poster said, make him think you're doing him a favor. The just remind him that the CO says 9 am Sat until 9 am Sunday, and that still allows plenty of time for you to celebrate Mother's day with your son.

Just remain calm, do not let him "smell your fear," because exes are like animals, they CAN smell it and they WILL feed off it. Be [censored]. Do not argue with him. He may choose to go ahead and exercise this visitation, but I bet you won't see him again for a long while. That is usually how they operate.

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#228320 - 05/11/07 01:52 PM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
PhoenixRising Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 01/05/07
Posts: 3681
Loc: New York
All of what you said reflects poorly on him as a husband. But won't be taken into consideration in determining visitation.

You need to be very careful when bad-mouthing your child's father, even when everything that you are saying is true.

Courts determine the "better" parent partially based on which parent is more willing to support the other parent's relationship.

If he can find witnesses that testify to you saying these things about him or worse yet, say these things in front of your child. He could file to overturn custody or at least request 50/50 custody.

You will find here, many parents that worry about the other parent's choices, we will support you and sympathize but you cannot withhold visitation.

PS: As other posters said, calling the police is an empty threat in 98% of the jurisdictions across the US; police will refuse to get involved in a civil matter.

What they will do though is write-up a report that he then can take to court and use against you.

In my case, the policeman brought out 3yrs of calendars and calculated that is was my ex'z EOW. But it wasn't; because we had flipped weekends. It didn't matter, because the CO takes precedence over verbal agreements.

If it is his weekend, if behooves you to follow the CO; otherwise it puts you in a negative light if he takes you to court. BTDT {{sympathy}}

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#228321 - 05/11/07 06:15 PM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
Debi Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 7157
There is not much about a CO that is emotionally "fair". IT's not set up for emotions. The way it seems your CO is written you really don't have a choice in giving him the time. It doesn't matter that he hasn't seen his son in 4 or 5 months. The CO lists the minimum amount of time he is allowed, and there is nothing to force him to take it. You're frustrated, and maybe rightfully so. This is YOUR situation and you're in the middle of it. We are not and can only tell you non-emotionally what you are bound to. I didn't hear that there was anything in there that gives you the right to demand a reunification period when dad disappears for a few months. Since there isn't you don't get to. If he shows up with the police alone you can definitely bring up the license. They will look it up and will not allow him to take the child if it IS suspended. They may even take him in or write him a ticket for driving with a suspended license. If he turns up with his wife driving the police will not stop the visistation on the idea that he "might end up driving after they leave." They may warn him against driving without a licesne but they can't follow him around to make sure he doesn't. It doesn't matter what he or his mother have done and said in the past. All of us have stories similar to yours and have hurtful situations we can drag up. It doesn't matter in court.

I'm sorry, I know that these are not the things you want to hear but the way your CO is there is nothing you can do.
_________________________
When we were together, you said you'd die for me. Now, I think it's time you kept your promise.

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#228322 - 05/11/07 06:40 PM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
cincsu Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 06/02/05
Posts: 4687
Loc: residence in AZ, case in CA
irregardless of what is going on with the child support it is still your obligation to follow your CO. if he doesn't show up it's your problem, and it sucks. since this has been going on for 5 months you should consider petitioning to reduce visitation to the amount of time that dad is available so you aren't stuck in this predicament.

is this his weekend to see the child? he could file contempt if you don't let him go.
_________________________
wife of 1, mother of 2, stepmother of .3475902453

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#228323 - 05/11/07 06:41 PM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
cincsu Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 06/02/05
Posts: 4687
Loc: residence in AZ, case in CA
why would it be stressful for him? there were periods of years that i didn't see my grandparents, but i was never stressed when they arrived.
_________________________
wife of 1, mother of 2, stepmother of .3475902453

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#228324 - 05/11/07 08:34 PM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: cincsu]
4yroldmom Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 40
I totally understand what all of you are saying.

I was really just looking for advice.

As mad as I am because of things he has done in the past I will not jepordize custody of my son. There are other reasons that I do not like the idea of him beign alone with his father but that is a different discussion for another day. I don't talk to anyone except my husband about the father and I try not to do that because it upsets him to see me upset. I definately don't talk to the kids about him no reason to bring them into it more than they already are and I want my son to make his own decision about how he feels about father and me and how we handled things right/wrong/indifferent when he is older. I just want to try to protect him as much as I can now.

Not seeing a Grandparent is one thing. Not seeing a parent is different. Different rules, different lifestyles.

My father traveled alot when I was younger but I talked to him every night or at the very least every other night. I never held that against him. The difference with son's father is that he doesn't call or see him. I look back on my family and realize that my parents were strict and I didn't see dad that often but I had a good relationship with both and my parents made an effort to attend things together or at least one of them would come. Son's father has never been to one event for school or even asked to come. He doesn't even know where the school is. Nor has he been there when son has had to go to the doctor for colds or anything else. When he does call he doesn't ask about son and he doesn't talk to son. It's about distrupting life in general it is so I know he is still out there. Negative comments whenever he can get them in. When you talk about who is bad mouthing who, even his sister and father have told us the things he says and does in reference to our family.

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#228325 - 05/12/07 03:38 AM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: 4yroldmom]
Debi Offline
Carpal \'Tunnel

Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 7157
Son's father has never been to one event for school or even asked to come. He doesn't even know where the school is. Nor has he been there when son has had to go to the doctor for colds or anything else.
****************************
I was just talking to a friend of mine last night. She was at her son's choir concert and the father of a child she's known since her son was in kindergarten was there. He asked where her husband was and she asked him when he had EVER seem him at a school function.

My point is that even if people are married there can still be a partner who doesn't show up at appointments or events. I'm sorry your x is like that but it still doesn't mean he shouldn't spend time with his son.
_________________________
When we were together, you said you'd die for me. Now, I think it's time you kept your promise.

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#228326 - 05/12/07 02:50 PM Re: No visitation since 1/1 and now saying he wants [Re: Debi]
4yroldmom Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/09/05
Posts: 40
I hear what you are saying but again feel that is different. That parent lives with that family and sees them or talks to them. Even if you don't go to every child event or doctor you certainly know more about what is going on in their lives since you eat dinner together, do homework together, etc.

Ex can give all the excuses he wants about his reasoning it is not good enough. He doesn't want to be in son's life he has said it before - he wanted to terminate his rights two years ago until he got the paperwork to do it. He immediately changed his mind when he read the paperwork saying that my husband would be able to adopt and give son his last name. I should have just filed it on my own but he scares me with his behavior so I didn't. I am ashamed I didn't and if he continues down the path that he is on now with visitation and everything else I will go down the termination path again. I was almost there this time because here you have to have no contact for 6 months or more along with some other mitigating circumstances.

Doesn't matter, biologically or not he is my husbands son more than he will ever be his fathers.

I did give in by the way. I called him back last night and told him I would meet him in a central location as we have in the past as long as it was 9am to 9am that is it. He had already changed his mind - mother's day afterall - he had made plans for him and his wife, he'll call me about next weekend. I think one poster before said something about control - oh yes, this was one of those moments I should have recognized the signs.

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