What should I do? Maury

Posted by: Susanf31

What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 01:48 AM

My CO states that medical expenses are to be split equally. I can't believe it says that and I can't believe I agreed to it! It was never an issue before because our income was roughly equal with my receiving alimony. But now that I'm no longer receiving alimony, I dug out our CO to see what it says.

Colorado Child Support guidelines clearly state that CP pays the first $250 each year of medical expenses and then the balance is split in ratio to income. (specifially Orthodontia)

If my ex attempts to hold me to the CO and I take this to mediation or court, will I win? Is it worth is? Colorado Child Support guidelines also clearly state that the presumtive resolution to any disputes will be to do what the guidelines state.

Is it worth fighting?
Posted by: katiefedup

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 01:50 AM

No, wait and see what he does? You are not married yet. Get the kids to the ortho this week, However your income goes down, so it seems like you are in good shape
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 01:53 AM

LOL.. you've GOT to be kidding me......
Posted by: katiefedup

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 02:07 AM

Runs, I took that as a serious question. Without her SS, her income goes down. Did I miss something? Help, I am a bit slow tonight...2 cavities filled.
Posted by: Cassie23

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 02:11 AM

You'd win. At least in NYS you would win. When my DH and his ex divorced (their incomes weren't equal) they agreed to 50/50 for any uncovered medical. That was actually what SHE asked for and he agreed. Sounds fair, I think. But in NYS under the guidelines uncovered medical is fixed on a ratio to income basis. So with her $8k (I think they based it on $15k though) and his a lot more- she went for a modification and got it! Now he pays 90 percent of all uncovered medical.

I think that if it is agreed upon in the first place then the CP and NCP should suffer the consequences. Kinda like you can't change custody agreements unless there is a change in circumstances. Although with you not getting alimony anymore- that is a change in circumstance, HOWEVER you knew that that day would come.
Posted by: katiefedup

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 02:13 AM

Except that her New Husband is lessing her COL
Posted by: JennyLynn

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:03 AM

DH is ordered to pay half of all medical expenses, no matter how much either he or BM make.

We don't even make half of what you make alone Susan, I'm sure. And if we can handle thousands of dollars in medical expenses (just our half) in the last couple of years, I know you can do it too!! :)

But I do understand what you're saying. You're losing alimony, something you're now used to living on and it being a part of your income. I can definitely see how it'd take a chunk in your expecations of what you will be spending on other expenses.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 11:14 AM

Her spousual support is going away.. because she is getting married.. therefore the household INCOME is going UP... hence the reason for that change.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 01:59 PM

No, my income is going down SIGNIFICANTLY, Run.

My spousal support is going away because I an voluntarily giving it up for the last 10 months. It would be going away anyway next September.

Don't forget, my ex just moved his girlfriend into his home, so his household income has now gone up.

What my new H will be contributing to the household isn't equilivent to what I am losing in alimony, income-wise.

My income, INCLUDING CS is now 35% of my ex's income AFTER HE DEDUCTS child support. In other words, including the CS I receive and he pays, my income is still only 35% of our total, combine incomes.

He makes 3 times what I make before CS is taken into consideration.

The guidelines/laws are clear that medical expenses are split in ratio to income. My CO says they are to be split equally. If I seek a modification of my court order, will I automatically win because it's not in line with Colorado law?

Before, it was fine because our income were roughly equal. Now there is a disparity of income.
Posted by: gr8Dad

Gee, sounds to me... - 10/04/06 02:03 PM

...like since you are VOLUNTARILY giving up the SS, the income disparity is VOLUNTARY. Doesn't sound like it is his problem.
Posted by: Miranda

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 02:04 PM

Sure Susan, you gave up alimony because your new H wants you to. Your terms were that your ex buy your daughter a car. So he agrees to that, and now you have sour grapes and want to run to court because it is not fair?

So much for your "happy" relationship with your ex. How about you TALK to him before you run off to the court house? That would be the most logical step...

YOu did not think of this when you agreed to give up $3300 a month in alimony? You'd think that someone who it on top of their game, a finanical guru if you will, would have had it all figured out BEFORE offering an end to the alimony.
Posted by: Emily67

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 02:25 PM

Wait a minute....I'm still stuck on this one.....

Don't forget, my ex just moved his girlfriend into his home, so his household income has now gone up.


So is Susan saying since the GF moved in, the income she brings to the household should be considered????????????


I don't even believe I'm reading this, so now SOs and new spouse's income should be considered when considering CS and expenses?

BTW, I'm with you Miranda, it's pretty crappy to give up SS on the terms of purchasing a car and then say, okay, now another condition to this....
Posted by: Avaya

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:18 PM

Susan, please. If you have medical expenses that will MATTER, honestly the money wont be your biggest worry. Are you REALLY going to gripe if you have to pay $50 and he has to pay $50 on a bill since the CO states that is so, when if going by the state statute, you would pay $30 and he would pay $70? are you really going to gripe about $20? Okay, maybe you would, but a normal person would not. Your court order says 50/50, so just deal with it. Don't make everyone else's life miserable JUST BECAUSE YOU CAN by trying to modify the CO. Like I said, if you end up with a $40,000 medical bill, the money will be the least of your worries with a child sick enough to rack up bills like that.
Posted by: LeAnne

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:18 PM

The money train has ended Susan, better start planning for the Cs support to end also, won't be long and that check won't be there either. You should have learned from the rest of us, you never count on SS or CS as a paycheck, I suggest you start downsizing now.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:19 PM

I think Susan is finally having reality hit her in the face. Welcome to the wonderful world of most of us!!!
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:21 PM

WAIT.. WAIT.. WAIT!!!

You are saying HIS INCOME WENT UP???? ROFL!

After HOW many times have you sat here.. and said HE WAS KEEPING HER UP..... as if she didn't work..... YOU claim SHE IS WITH HIM.. because she can't SUPPORT HERSELF... SO NOW... when it comes to serving you.. all of a sudden HIS INCOME WENT UP? YOU ARE FOS!!!

PICK A STORY AND STAY WITH IT.. WILL YA?
Posted by: LeAnne

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:25 PM

I think what is really getting her or gecko's goat, is that the money she got for SS is now going to be staying in the home for the new GF. 3300.00 a month, gosh I could pay all our bills a month and only work partime, just so I wouldn't be bored.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:29 PM

Heck with the extra $3,300 per month, I could stay home permanently (retire) and have a wonderful life.
Posted by: matart1

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:33 PM

I believe Susan's true colors are showing.

however she is too wishy washy to keep her story or beliefs straight.

wonder how she would feel (since she likes to reneg on agreements) if her ex would say that he would no longer have to uphold his end of the agreement for the car if it is okay for her to change at will what she had agreed to in court.

how sad.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:35 PM

I think I should get the $3,300 and the car too!!! Sounds fair to me!!! LOL
Posted by: asurvivor

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 03:38 PM

Talk to your ex about this Susan. He seems to be a pretty reasonable guy who's always been there for his kids best interest so don't under estimate him now. GF or no GF, he'll be there for the girls.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 05:22 PM

Yes, I'm going to talk to him first. My concern is that his income is going up much faster than mine. Once I'm no longer receiving CS on my oldest child, the income disparity will be huge. So should I deal with this now? My youngest will be in braces for some time, wears glasses and has some dental problems...so just her basic medical care could get pricey.

No, I won't spend thousands fighting this in court. But I think I will take it as far as mediation...which our CO says we have to do before filing anything with the courts.

As far as downsizing??? I already have. As far as his GF living with him. She works as a personal trainer and earns an income. I said she was marrying him for his health insurance and ability to watch her D while she works and goes to school at night.

I just think I should get these financial aspects worked out sooner rather than later.

My question was...how will the courts view this if our CO is in direct defiance of Colorado Child Support laws. Will it be an automatic win for me or not??
Posted by: matart1

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 05:32 PM

why do you feel that there should not be some sort of income disparity after cs and ss ceases?

is there a court agreement that your ex is still supposed to provide for you even after the kids are grown and have families of their own?

is your ex court ordered to support your arse until your dead?

at what point does your kids and coochie cease to be an income source to your ex?

hey jackasss - of course there will be an income disparity after cs and ss ceases.

I thought you were a little more planned and self-sufficent for the future than what you are suggesting.
Posted by: M5M5

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 05:38 PM

LOL @ coochie!
Posted by: gr8Dad

The spousal support YOU agreed to... - 10/04/06 05:38 PM

...was in order to level the income disparities. It does not guarantee ANYTHING. Obviously, he works harder than you, and makes more money BECAUSE of that.
Posted by: myangels

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 05:40 PM

Susan, if you already have a CO states who pays what then why fight it?

You gave up SS on your own because your H wanted you too, so now thats HIS responsibility. Just tell him to give you whatever it is that you need.

If the deal was SS in exchange to a car, then thats it. Consider that the rest of your SS.

What your X makes when CS and SS is over, shouldnt matter to you anymore since he would be done with obligations.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 05:52 PM

SS is over in Nov. However, CS is FAR from over so his income still matters to me.

Our CO does not reflect child support laws. My only question was if I tried to modify our CO to reflect CS laws, which clearly state that medical expenses are split in ratio to income, no "equally" would I win?

I have always felt that the costs of the children should be equitable...i.e. the burden of the expenses of the kids should be equitable to both parents.

I've been preparing for losing SS the entire time. I'm ready for that. Now I just was CS to be fair, based on our income, which it is. But the medical part is not fair and equitable nor is it in line with Colorado law.

This has nothing to do with SS. It was ending next Sept. anyway, so I'd be dealing with this same issue next Sept. anyway.

By the way, ex-H is in agreement to stop paying SS outside of our CO, so he's as much on the hook for the ramifications of that as I am. Otherwise, he could choose to keep paying it.
Posted by: gr8Dad

Sure you do... - 10/04/06 05:58 PM

"I have always felt that the costs of the children should be equitable...i.e. the burden of the expenses of the kids should be equitable to both parents."

HOW can you say that? The costs were to be slit 50/50, because he was providing you with a large percentage of your income. Now that he is no longer going to be doing that, you want him to pay a higher percentage of expenses? WHAT!?! Stand up on your own two feet.

I bet if YOUR income went up, you wouldn't be rushing off to court to have YOUR percentage refigured. Stop being such a GREEDY, BLOOD SVCKING person, and just be happy that you GOT SS, and will GET CS, and earn your OWN money.
Posted by: Miranda

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 06:04 PM

I love how the "direct defiance of Colorado law" is situational. When you had more $$$ the violation of law was okay and you accepted it...now that you lose money it is a VIOLATION OF LAW? Don't think so LOL...
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Sure you do... - 10/04/06 06:04 PM

I do earn my own money. I am seeking to have my ex pay his share of our kid's medical expenses in ratio to our respective earnings.

I think he would be the greedy one asking me to pay as much as he is when i'm making $50k or more less than he is.

Seeking a modification in our CO to reflect Colorado Child Support LAWS is not being greedy. I'm trying to make things fair and equitable.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: Sure you do... - 10/04/06 06:12 PM

WHY DO YOU THINK THEY SHOULD BE FAIR AND EQUITABLE?????????? Leave that poor man who had the stupidity to procreate with you alone! Fair and equitable would mean he could earn an income to better HIS standard of living, NOT YOURS. You're an idiot, a greedy self serving idiot. I hope that man whose agreed to marry you will see his chance to run before he puts another stumbling block in his and his children's lives.

If your ex is so reasonable and responsible, then if your daughter had a need you can't afford, you should be able to tell him, 'here's the doctor bill and I can't afford to pay but $$, can you handle the rest?' I would expect him to say that he would, but it would serve you right if he refused.
Posted by: myangels

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 06:18 PM

Susan. *** My only question was if I tried to modify our CO to reflect CS laws, which clearly state that medical expenses are split in ratio to income, no "equally" would I win?***

You would win hands down, if thats the law in your state.
Posted by: gr8Dad

Yeah, and 50/50 split of the expenses... - 10/04/06 06:22 PM

...was FINE when he was paying you $3300 a month in alimony. But now that he ISN'T, and you didn't use the SS to better your life and make the SAME as him, he has to pay MORE.

Well, FIRST of all, you would have NO case until NEXT September, because you have VOLUNTARILY decreased spousal support, in exchange for a car for your child. So, JUST like a person who is VOLUTARILY underemployed, you CANNOT change the CO based on something you VOLUNTARILY did.

Second, you do NOT have a right to ALWAYS make the same as him. You nickle and dime crap SO much that it is RIDICULOUS. You are DIVORCED. You share a child, and the court order says you share expenses, 50/50. You KNEW that the SS would eventually end, and that he would make more than you, so you SHOULD have had the decree reflect that. But no, you agreed to 50/50 split of medical costs. I don't CARE what the law says NOW about medical, YOUR order says 50/50, and you agreed to that.

But, like all things in your life, as soon as you lose money (even though that money wasn't your to BEGIN with), you want him to make it up.

For God's sake Susan, stand up on your own two feet and live your life on your OWN, you will be surprised at how liberating it is.
Posted by: gr8Dad

I doubt it... - 10/04/06 06:23 PM

The law is POST her divorce decree. Unless they grandfathered old cases (which they RARELY do), she will still be under the provisions of her decree.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 06:24 PM

Thanks for answering the question, Myangles. :)

To the rest of you slamming me...I find it very interesting. I'm basically asking the same thing that M5 has been going through. Should I return to court to have a CO modified to make it fair and equitable when you have one parent financially more capable of paying for things than the other parent it.

If there was a major medical problem with our kids, I would be driven to the poor house far earlier than my ex. Kind of the same thing going on with M5 right now.

You are supporting her in ther quest to have her CO modified so that she doens't have to pay 1/2, being driven to the poor house by a wealthier ex, who has a great capacity to pay 1/2 than they do.

Just goes to show that your advice is biased based on how much you like the person who is asking the question. MY ex has a greater capacity to pay for medical bills than I do. If I don't seek a modification now, I could find myself in big trouble should the unthinkable happen and one of my kids is in need of major medical care.

I think for my own safety, i should have the CO modified now rather than wait for something to happen and find myself in financial trouble.
Posted by: gr8Dad

Wrong, El Greedo... - 10/04/06 06:28 PM

M% is looking to have her CO CLARIFIED, in that it says half of activities that they agree on, the BM is not consulting Dad, and then billing him. YOUR order is CLEAR, it says you each pay HALF.

You KNOW your going to get a big jump in CS at the end of the year, when your income is much lower than usual, so take the extra money your getting, marry the guy you love, move on with your life and STFU!!
Posted by: myangels

Re: I doubt it... - 10/04/06 06:29 PM

Gr8dad, I dont about that, shes a woman and I dont mean to sound sexist but woman go into court with their sad sobby stories and win because judges feel bad for them.

In her case, dad makes a shi% load of money she makes a decent amount but since SS isnt there anymore you never know she has a good chance to win since that IS the law and there has been a major change in circumstatances. Judges HAVE to go by the law,
Posted by: gr8Dad

I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:32 PM

He pays her to make the incomes the same, and then has to pay half of medical and expenses. He gets to STOP paying SS early so he can buy his child a car, per HER agreement (but WHAT do you want to be that when they figure CS at the end of the year, she won't include the cost of the car as income?), so then he gets to pay more in CS, and she STILL wants to take it to court so he has to pay MORE in medical.

She is like a black HOLE, svcking money from anywhere she can get it.
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:37 PM

Susan, what kind of car did dad end up getting D?
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:39 PM

Gr8dad, right but what happens is the law is what it is. And to be honest dad shouldnt complain if he makes a good amount.

If I made what he does, X and I would NEVER have to go to court because I would be throwing her money left and right she wouldnt even know what to do with it. Dad should just agree to pay a little more since it wont really effect him.
Posted by: youngatheart

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 06:40 PM

Susan,

I believe you are going to modify child support now that SS is ending, correct? If that is the case, then you need to request that that % of other court-mandated expenses be changed as well.

In my state, it is part of the calculation when they figure up child support. Say, you make 33% of the total income now, you would pay 33% of the court-mandated expenses. He would pay the other 67%.

So, in answer to your question, just address it in the child support negotiations, as it will likely have to be looked at there anyway.
Posted by: mommachele

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:41 PM

k so let me see if I get this..

SS is ending to YOU...Not really ending "period" as the money is going to be spent on childs car..so it is in fact being paid just not going into your account, but you are still benefiting from it because you will not be paying anything for childs said car? Ex "still" has that out of pocket right?

CS will be "increased" because Ex is now making more money?

So now Ex is "still" paying SS as per CO just not to you AND you will get an increase in CS...so in all reality Ex will be paying "more" out than before until the time comes NEXT year when SS "really"ends.

If I got all that right then, I don't think going to court right now to modify the "medical" part will show you as anything but kinda greedy...Not being mean but think about it...Until you can show that the Ex is really "bringing" in more income, your income disparity is NOT there and that cannot be shown until the SS is REALLY finished.

Chele
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:41 PM

and Im not talking about 15 co-pays and that stuff Im talking about hundreds of dollars for crowns and thousands of dollars for braces.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:53 PM

Susan, what kind of car did dad end up getting D?
++++++++++

He and I discussed that a few days ago. She's only 15, so there won't be a car until next year.

We agreed it would be about an $8,000 used car. He will finance it over 4 years. He'll pay the loan the first 2.5 years and I will pay the last 1.5 years of the loan.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 06:54 PM

As far as downsizing??? I already have. As far as his GF living with him. She works as a personal trainer and earns an income. I said she was marrying him for his health insurance and ability to watch her D while she works and goes to school at night.

-----------> um.. no... your exact words is that she was with him for his paychecks.... let's be clear on this...

AND.. why would she need him for insurance? Her daughter has been ill since birth.. and she's managed to make it this far..without your ex... AND.. her MOTHER lived with her and LIVES with them now.. so again.... why would she need your ex for that....

You were clear... she needed his paychecks.. verbatim!
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:55 PM

I wouldn't do that if I was him - you might not continue what you promised since you are starting to get a "track record" now of not following agreements.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:57 PM

SS is ending to YOU...Not really ending "period" as the money is going to be spent on childs car..so it is in fact being paid just not going into your account, but you are still benefiting from it because you will not be paying anything for childs said car? Ex "still" has that out of pocket right?
++++++++++++

No, I am giving up $33,000 in alimony in exchange for my ex committing to spending $6,000 on a car for my D next year.

++++++++
CS will be "increased" because Ex is now making more money?
+++++++++

Yes, we've already exchanged paystubs. Beginning Nov. 1st, my CS will increase $438 a month.

+++++++
So now Ex is "still" paying SS as per CO just not to you AND you will get an increase in CS...so in all reality Ex will be paying "more" out than before until the time comes NEXT year when SS "really"ends.
++++++++++

No, not even close. Ex will save major $$$. Ending alimony will save him $33,000, but will cost him $6000 in car and $5256 in child support increase. He'll lose the tax deduction, so all in all, he pockets about $14,000 net by ending alimony early.
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 06:58 PM

Gr8dad, then she wouldn't be winning in the SS case because she was getting 3300 a mth and the car is only going to cost 8k plus shes going to pay some of it. Now I thought that D was getting a brand new car that was going to be like 17k then I would say it was worth the trade. With dad paying everything. Susan ended up losing money with this deal.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 06:58 PM

-----------> um.. no... your exact words is that she was with him for his paychecks.... let's be clear on this...

AND.. why would she need him for insurance? Her daughter has been ill since birth.. and she's managed to make it this far..without your ex... AND.. her MOTHER lived with her and LIVES with them now.. so again.... why would she need your ex for that....

You were clear... she needed his paychecks.. verbatim!
++++++++

Yes, I said she's after his money and his health benefits. I just learned that mom is moving back to wherever her home is in December. Mom was only here helping her D until her D found someone else to help her.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:00 PM

Money she agreed to loose.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 07:02 PM

I find that hard to believe... I really do.. I honestly.. think you are making that up... Mom has lived with her and you were talking about them re-arranging the house and all....

Either way..... I think it's crazy that you would agree to something... then try to retract it.... I feel for your dear ex.... I really do..
Posted by: Emily67

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:02 PM

You are giving up $33,000 in alimony not just for a car but because YOUR DH ASKED YOU TOO.....those were your choices.

He's pocketing $14,000? Hello...it's his $14,000, he earned it and you agreed not to take it!
Posted by: rocketgirl

Re: Sure you do... - 10/04/06 07:02 PM

Fair and equitable is 50/50.. give him the girls 50% of the time and then you can give up CS....how's THAT sound?

Fair and equitable.. what a freakin joke THAT is.
Posted by: Emily67

Want clarify...my opinion is not situational..... - 10/04/06 07:03 PM

The facts are she is voluntarily stopping SS to appease her soon to be new DH and using a condition of a car..since the ex is buying a car, he is living up to his agreement. Whether he benefits or not, this was her idea and she agreed to it.

Susan, my opinion isn’t situational based on who is posting….my belief is this…things like child care and medical care should be split 50/50 regardless of income status. Why? I think that since it takes 2 to have the child, that both should be equally responsible for a basic need such as medical. Medical costs are not situational based on income. If you and I go to the same doctor and I make $50,000 a year and you make $25,000 a year, the bill is the same. Medical care isn’t (or shouldn’t be) a “standard of living they have become accustomed to” expense unlike, housing, clothing or activities. Every parent should split medical 50/50 IMHO.

If SS is supposed to bring parity to the incomes for a temporary time frame in order to assist you maintain a lifestyle…it had a shelf life…once he has completed his “restitution” why shouldn’t he enjoy the money he earns? From what you have said, he is a good provider of CS…..SS was for YOU, not the house. He has lived up to his obligation and agreed to your terms. Doesn’t he have a right to make choices for his life and enjoy the fruits of his labors as you and your DH do?
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:03 PM

Runs, right and she knew that. She knew the differerence. So if dad pays a little extra towards medicals it wont really effect that much.

Susan, Dad pay $5256 in CS? Wow.
I know that you have teenagers right? Im going to ask you a question and its not sarcastic. Do you think that you will not have enough to pay medical expenses just 50 50? Do you think you can take your half out of the CS?
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Sure you do... - 10/04/06 07:04 PM

Fair and equitable would be him having them - what is the number 67% of the time and Susan the balance. That would be fair and equitable.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:06 PM

She also requires him to pay 50% of their activities too on TOP of the CS.. it's nuts.. really nuts!

She will NEVER give this poor man a chance of peace and happines... it's always something..... It breaks my heart for him.
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:07 PM

Runs, are you sure? Did she say that?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:08 PM

Yes, this "deal" will cost me a little bit of money, but not a whole lot.

The $39,600 I was receiving in alimony was putting me in a higher tax bracket, so I was paying more taxes on my earnings AND alimony. My child support is now going up. Plus my new H moving in and splitting bills with me....all means that I really didn't need alimony anymore. I'm back on my feet and doing fine. I'm actually happy and kind of relieved to be doing away with it. When all was said and done, it wasn't netting me that much money and was costing my ex more than it was netting me.

I figured out that it was only putting about $10 to $15k in my pocket. If I gave that up and got my ex to agree to buying most of my D's car, that would make it almost even. But in reality, I'm losing about $10k on the deal.

Now, I just want us to be on equitable footing in regards to the kids. And to me, that includes spitting their expenses equitably...in ratio to income as the laws state.

It's important to me to be and remain financially stable. I don't like leaving my future up to chance. Having that 50/50 split of expenses "on the books" bothers me...i feel like it leaves me wide open to financial troubles should the children need any major medical care. I feel like I should move to rectify it now rather than wait for something bad to happen.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:10 PM

She has before.. if you go searching under stepfamily boards.. you will find stuff in there.... she's posted how much it cost for all her teens activities.. and she's posted that he pays her half..... it's nuts... really nuts....
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 07:12 PM

I find that hard to believe... I really do.. I honestly.. think you are making that up... Mom has lived with her and you were talking about them re-arranging the house and all....
=++++++++

It's true. My girls just told me that M's mom is giving them their X-mas present early because she's moving back to New Orleans, where her home and husband are, in December. She was only here temporarily.

They told me this when I asked them if their dad was going to turn the basement into a room for grandma. They said he wasn't because she's leaving...she doesn't live her.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:12 PM

It's important to me to be and remain financially stable. I don't like leaving my future up to chance. Having that 50/50 split of expenses "on the books" bothers me...i feel like it leaves me wide open to financial troubles should the children need any major medical care. I feel like I should move to rectify it now rather than wait for something bad to happen.

---------->with the money guru you have claimed to be.. you should have already had yourself secure with the BUTT LOAD of extra dough you've been getting... wise investsments, etc would had covered that.

When does it end for this poor man Susan? When will you stop draining him of HIS PAYCHECKS.. you claim this new woman is doing this.. and I've told you before.. just because YOU DO IT.. doesn't mean all women are like that...
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:13 PM

Runs, if its costs more than the 5k she gets in CS then yes it should be split.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:14 PM

And what about ex's financial future. Instead of 50/50, he will have about 67%, no worries about that, uh?
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:14 PM

Run, let me add to that, if the woman that hes with does it I would like to think she has more right to do it since that is his woman. I know my woman drains the hell out of me LOL
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:15 PM

Susan, Dad pay $5256 in CS? Wow.
I know that you have teenagers right? Im going to ask you a question and its not sarcastic. Do you think that you will not have enough to pay medical expenses just 50 50? Do you think you can take your half out of the CS?
+++++++++

I'm not concerned at all about small medicals. I don't even ask him for 1/2 of co-pays ....anything under $50, I just pay.

I'm talking about major things like braces, major dental work, accidents/injuries/illnesses not covered by insurance.

Small stuff? I've never billed him and never would.
Posted by: Emily67

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:15 PM

Runs...

Not all women do and the sad thing is that women who suck men dry and continue to attempt to long after the divorce, give independent, financially responsible women no chance of having a good name. I work, make more than my DH, support my son and myself 100% and because my DH's own mother and ex are blood-suckers, he has an inherent distrust of women and he has to continually work on that....the fact that I am the opposite of them doesn't matter, his two examples burned men and that's what he is used to.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:16 PM

LOL.. the activities should be split 50/50? That's nuts... there is no reason why this man should have to pay over 5K in CS and then do another 2 grand for activites Susan decides to put them in... and they aren't cheap activities... I mean.. golf, cheerleading, horseback riding and I think Tennis....
He is re-marrying.. (JUST LIKE YOU) and he deserves to have a break... he deserves to take care of his new family..... without stress of $$ from Susan.
Posted by: mommachele

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:17 PM

Okay then why don't you just keep getting the SS for another 3 months and buy the car yourself? If you really don't need the money because of new SO and he is splitting the bills then that money can be put away for the car and then there will be NO finance chages because of no financing.

2. If you are giving up so much for your SO then why doesnt he cover that amount?

3. Put your child on YOUR insurance in addition to your Exs...that way if anything DOES come up you are double covered and you can forgo all the silly court stuff and keep your relationship with your Ex a good one.

Chele
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:18 PM

Runs, if its costs more than the 5k she gets in CS then yes it should be split.
+++++++++++

Clarificatin, I get more than $5k a year in CS. I'm saying that my CS will increase $5k a year after alimony ends.

All this is about now is CS. He will be paying CS based on state guidelines. I was medical expenses to be share per guidelines as well. That's all I'm asking for. I'm not asking for a dime more than state guidelines says he should be paying.
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:19 PM

Susan, okay so thats reasonable. Im sure it would be easier for him to come up with the money since he makes more.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:20 PM

You know... I am thankful I do not depend on my ex for a dime.. (instead he depends on me). When we re-did this agreement... at first he was going to pay me x amount is CS... and I thought about it and said NO... instead.... lets see "if" my power goes up.. IF my electricity goes up.. IF my groceries go up.... and if they do... let's look at it.. let's wait and see.... I said help me pay for G's activities, doctor's bills.. etc.... If I am going broke.. then we will look at it.. but right now. .it's too early to tell... I was already paying for her cell... so that's NO NEW expense... she was already here 15 days.... I work out of my home.. so the power is already HIGH because I am here all the time...etc.. I just didn't think it was right....
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:23 PM

Runs, okay 2k a mth in activites and 5k a month in CS?

If that is correct than yeah I would think that Susan should pay more towards the activities.

But the thing is that we are comparing his life with ours. Im assuming that 6 grand a month to him is nothing since, she says he doesnt mind or doesnt fight about it.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:24 PM

Myangels... as we know... I am sure his side would be very different! LOL!
Posted by: Emily67

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:24 PM

I don't get CS but if I did, I would just put it in a college fund for my son....simple, uncomplicated and no drama over money. Do I think his Dad is a deadbeat by not contributing? Sure. At the end of the day though, I do have the satisfaction of being financially independent.

My DH's ex is always out for $$$$...she got alimony, no debt, and all the marital property at the time of divorce.....she is allergic to work, created big time debt, and doesn't make good financial choices...she still thinks my DH should be on the hook to her because she is the mother of his children.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 07:25 PM

[quote]Thanks for answering the question, Myangles. :)

[/quote]

Don't you mean 'thanks for giving me the answer you want to hear?'
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:27 PM

Runs, okay 2k a mth in activites and 5k a month in CS?

If that is correct than yeah I would think that Susan should pay more towards the activities.

+++++++++

LOL HOly Sh*t, guys...you are wayyyy off. I said my CS is going up $438 a month, is is $5256 more a YEAR...not a month.

I will get well UNDER $2000 a month in CS beginning Nov. 1st.
Posted by: myangels

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 07:27 PM

Avaya, no because everyone was talking about her giving up the SS and CS and bla bla bla, it was a simple question.

The law sides with her on it.
Posted by: Stirling

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 07:28 PM

"Colorado Child Support guidelines clearly state that CP pays the first $250 each year of medical expenses and then the balance is split in ratio to income. (specifially Orthodontia)"

I think the oppretive word here is "guidelines" which indicates that this is a suggestion rather than a black and white statute with a mandatory award. Accordingly, there is wiggle room here for negotiation between the parties. This window of opportunity to negotiate in good faith should occur when negotiating the divorce agreement. Which you and your Ex did with the advice of respective legal counsel.

You may want to check and see if the CO CS guidelines were amended after your divorce to include the cited language. Reason being that if at the time of your divorce it was common practice to award medical expenses prorata to income, I would find it hard to believe that your savy lawyer didn't insist that such a provision be included in your divorce agreement (unless you negotiated this provision away). If this provision was added to the guidelines after your divorce then I would check to see if it is to be applied prospectively or retroactively. Typically they are appled prospectively.

Susan, from your prior posts I think that it is a fair statement to say the you negotiated for yourself, with the help of experienced legal council, a very rich divorce agreement. This agreement was signed in good faith by both you and your Ex. It also appears that you and your Ex have lived by this agreement for many years. I'm sure that there are parts of your divorce agreement that your Ex doesn't like but he has chosen to stick to his word and live up to what he agreed to in good faith. Why can't you do the same?

Susan there are more important things out there other than money. Why don't you spend your time and energy on your new relationship/marriage rather then on figuring out how to get an extra buck out of your Ex. If you want your Ex's money that bad then you should have stayed married to him.

Susan, you have stated that you want this modification because you have voluntarily given SS 10 months early. From prior posts you stated that you did this because your husband to be had some kind of "issue" with you receiving SS once you are married. I also recall you saying that your husband to be was going to be making up some of the SS you will be giving up. I also recall you stating that your CS would significantly increase due to the loss of SS. I also recall that you negotiated with your Ex to get a car for your daughter if you released him from his SS obligation. It seems to me that you should have addressed the medical expense issue with your Ex when you negotiated for the car. It also seems to me that if you gave up your SS early to please your husband to be , then maybe he should subsidize the medical expenses.

I also have to wonder what you were planning on doing in 10 months when SS would have ended anyway. You have had years to prepare for this so why is this an issue now. If ending SS 10 months early screwed up your financial plan, then you should not have ended it early. However, you did make a conscious decision to end it early, and as a result you own the natural consequences related to that decision. If your financial plan is screwed up it is your fault. If you need someone to help put your financial plan back on track I suggest going to your husband to be since it was his "issues" that inspired you to give up your SS early.

Finally, to answer your specific question, it is probably unlikely that a judge would change the provisions of your divorce agreement since it was negotiated and signed in good faith. Also, the CS guideliens are just that, guidelines which do not have the affect of law. What you and your Ex agreed to was in line with the guidelines at the time and was not offensive to the judge who granted your divorce. Also, taking your entire divorce agreement as a whole this is a very minor part, and taken as a whole is probably very fair agreement. Again, I feel that it is unlikely that a Judge will give you a second bite at the apple. Suck it up and live up to the agreement that you signed in good faith.
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:29 PM

Susan. Ohh okay. I was thinking how lucky your X is to be able to even pay that much in CS!!

If that is the case then activities should be split just as long as he agrees to them and you talk to him before hand.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:29 PM

$2000 a month in activties? Nope, not me. I spend about $500 a month in activities. Piano lessons. Flute lessons. two instrument rentals. Tennis lessons for youngest, golf lessons for oldest. But that's only during the warm months. No golf or tennis during the winter.
Posted by: Marie_ss

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:31 PM

"All this is about now is CS. He will be paying CS based on state guidelines. I was medical expenses to be share per guidelines as well. That's all I'm asking for. I'm not asking for a dime more than state guidelines says he should be paying."

It's not just about CS. You are voluntarily becoming UNDEREMPLOYED by giving up your SS, so now you want to turn around and ding your ex for more CS because your choices. If the ex were to do this (ie, be underemployed), you would be screaming to court in a heartbeat, just as you're thinking of doing now.

The right thing to do is to continue SS - why should your SO be involved in that decision unless he's willing to accept the consequences of less household income and make up for it? Invest the money so that when SS officially terminates, you'll have the funds to meet your end of the 50/50 medical.

Be smart, not selfish, and don't repeat history to become a financial slave to your soon-to-be-husband.
Posted by: gr8Dad

I don't think it does... - 10/04/06 07:32 PM

The law about splitting medical using income shares is a NEW law, she ahs NOT mentioned that it was grandfathered, so the LAW is that her decree says 50/50

Personally, I hope her ex has had ENOUGH, and stands up to her in court. Of course, having listened to her for years, he might make enough that he would pay her just to shut up and leave him alone, LMAO!
Posted by: Avaya

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:32 PM

[quote]
Susan, Dad pay $5256 in CS? [/quote]

No, that's just the Increase, not the total amount. That's the annual increase in addition to whatever ungodly amount he is already paying.
Posted by: mommachele

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:37 PM

well I can't figure out what amount you are getting for CS but it is alot more than I am...

Know why...Because I never ever went in to have it increased...and it has been 11 years...

Know why?? Because my ex has always been good about doing things for and with the kids. (like yours Susan) and again like you I never asked him for 1/2 the co-pays, or any other small things...so when it came time for the bigger things, Braces, sports,and now college for our oldest, he was/is always happy to help..and I also ALWAYS keep my kids double covered for health and dental...so even with the braces it ended up costing less even with the extra insurance...sooooooo

You reap what you sew...Be careful Susan..you may think that it is your "right" to get all that the laws say when you think you should get it...but at what cost in the long run...Why go after it and worry about it if you don't "need" it? If you are not careful you may end up really needing his help (money) later and because of all the "small" things you "thought" you were entitled to, and went after him for he may not be there when you REALLY need it...ya know..

Good Luck
Chele
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 07:37 PM

Susan, you have stated that you want this modification because you have voluntarily given SS 10 months early.
+++++++

No, Stirling, i didn't say that. I don't want this modification because I've given up SS. I want this modification because I make 35% of what he makes and the Child Support guidelines say that medical expenses shoudl be split in ratio to income.

+++++++++
It seems to me that you should have addressed the medical expense issue with your Ex when you negotiated for the car. It also seems to me that if you gave up your SS early to please your husband to be , then maybe he should subsidize the medical expenses.
+++++++

You are correct. I should have addressed this issue when I agreed to give up SS. However, I DIDN'T KNOW!! I just got out my decree last night and I couldn't believe my eyes!

I'm not giving up SS to please my new H. Yes, that's how it started, but after doing the math, I felt it was best for everyone to do it. I'm kind of excited about leaving that in the past and moving forward...with the only ties to my ex is via the kids.

+++++++++
also have to wonder what you were planning on doing in 10 months when SS would have ended anyway
+++++++++

I'd be doing the same thing I'm doing now. Everything was fine...ex and I are working out what the new CS will be. That led me to pull out my old decree and that's where I read about this 50/50 split. I would have done the same thing 10 months from now.

++++++++++
Finally, to answer your specific question, it is probably unlikely that a judge would change the provisions of your divorce agreement since it was negotiated and signed in good faith. Also, the CS guideliens are just that, guidelines which do not have the affect of law. What you and your Ex agreed to was in line with the guidelines at the time and was not offensive to the judge who granted your divorce. Also, taking your entire divorce agreement as a whole this is a very minor part, and taken as a whole is probably very fair agreement. Again, I feel that it is unlikely that a Judge will give you a second bite at the apple. Suck it up and live up to the agreement that you signed in good faith.
++++++++++++

Fair enough...and I might just do that. I don't think I would pursue this any further than mediation. However, I would like to add that the Child Support laws state that if there is any dispute about how to split medical expenses, the courts will follow the guidelines.

Thanks for your input...you always give level-headed, good advice.
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:38 PM

Momma, she doesnt just go to court all the time to get it raised the CO says that the HAVE to exchange paystubs and figure it out at the end of the year, or Im assuming a major change in circumstances
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:39 PM

If that is the case then activities should be split just as long as he agrees to them and you talk to him before hand.
++++++++++

Which is what we've always done. But this isn't about activities...I'll continue to split those with him 50/50. This is about the medical expense clause in our CO.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:40 PM

It's not just about CS. You are voluntarily becoming UNDEREMPLOYED by giving up your SS, so now you want to turn around and ding your ex for more CS because your choices. If the ex were to do this (ie, be underemployed), you would be screaming to court in a heartbeat, just as you're thinking of doing now.
++++++++++

LOL That's a new one! I'm UNDEREMPLOYED because I'm NOT receiving SS?? LOL Well, if weren't a great deal for my ex, he wouldn't have agreed to it. He would have just said "no thanks...I'm continue paying you $3300 a month for 10 months per our CO." Umm....trust me...he's not saying that.
Posted by: myangels

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:41 PM

Susan. I know its not about activities its about the medical its just I was commenting on something that Runs had said. You know everyone brought your whole life story I cant help but to ask and comment on those as well!!
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:44 PM

You reap what you sew...Be careful Susan..you may think that it is your "right" to get all that the laws say when you think you should get it...but at what cost in the long run...Why go after it and worry about it if you don't "need" it? If you are not careful you may end up really needing his help (money) later and because of all the "small" things you "thought" you were entitled to, and went after him for he may not be there when you REALLY need it...ya know..
++++++++++

Mamamache, you could be right. It might be better to leave this be and save the fight for bigger issues.

The only reason I'm even worrying about it at this point is because my youngest is set to get braces at the end of the year. Just waiting on a few more baby teeth. If she needs peridontal surgey like my oldest did, we are talking about $8 to $9k!
Posted by: mommachele

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:45 PM

Myangels,

Either way she is getting it raised as often as she can..right? CO or not..it IS getting raised...My point was that just because you are entitled to it NOW by the laws doesnt mean it wont effect the relationship she has with her Ex in the long run and it is very likely that this kind of behavior WILL effect it badly when she needs the most help from him at a later date...Right now she doesn't "need" it but she is still wanting to go after it....See what I mean..I am just trying to get her to look at the BIG picture...not "how much am I entitled to right now" picture...


Chele
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:46 PM

You forgot your horseback riding... I remember posts year ago about how expensive Horseback riding was.. infact you jumped on another poster because they didn't have the "right" equipment/horse... etc.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:47 PM

Her whole life story is brought into this for the BIG picture! This man pays/pays and then pays...... it never stops for him.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:48 PM

You forgot your horseback riding... I remember posts year ago about how expensive Horseback riding was.. infact you jumped on another poster because they didn't have the "right" equipment/horse... etc.
+++++++

My kids don't ride horses. I rode horses when I was a kid...into adulthood.

I wanted to get them into it, but it's just too expensive in this area.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:50 PM

This man pays/pays and then pays...... it never stops for him.
++++++++

This man pays child support per the state guidelines. He pays 1/2 of extra curricular activities.

I'm not asking him to pay ANYTHING at this point. I'm just asking that should large medical bills arrive, we split them in ratio to our incomes...as the state law says they should be split.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:50 PM

AH! They did though... at one time.. I do remember you talking about it.. so.. they don't "now"....
Posted by: mommachele

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:51 PM

If you think that is going to be needed then I would Definitely get your child double covered asap...You wouldn't believe how much you can save by putting out and extra $20 a month now instead of having to come up with 8-9K later..and in my case it costs nothing to keep mine Double covered as is a single or single+ dependents..so even if we had 10 more kids the premium would remain the same and that my dear is a PEACE of mind when it comes to kids (my boys) and things they break each year!!! LOL

Chele
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:53 PM

but your order says otherwise.. right? The order you agreed to.

He does pay Susan.. He paid SS, he paid CS and he is constantly being hit for more $$ for this/that....

I tell ya this... forgo the activities that he is NOT ordered to pay.. and then ask him about this new "law". How about that? Will that work? OR do you want him to pay you CS, 1/2 of activities AND the new law?
Posted by: Marie_ss

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 07:53 PM

"I'm UNDEREMPLOYED because I'm NOT receiving SS??"

Yes, you will be underemployed. You've always said that the $3300 SS was meant to equalize your incomes, it put you in a higher tax bracket, and now that you're voluntarily giving up the SS, you feel the medical should now be based on income ratio because your income won't be as high. Sounds like underemployment to me.

Understand - I'm a CP mom who never received SS and CS (by choice), and have never felt that my ex should deserve anything but a relationship with our son. I find your mentality of dinging the ex just because he is a higher wage earner distasteful.

If he wants to contribute more to the kids, let him do it but not by court order. You've always made him out to be a great father and financial contributor without asking, so why not give him the benefit of the doubt?
Posted by: gr8Dad

Your so FOS your eyes are brown... - 10/04/06 07:55 PM

"You are correct. I should have addressed this issue when I agreed to give up SS. However, I DIDN'T KNOW!! I just got out my decree last night and I couldn't believe my eyes!"

WHO do you think you are kidding? I bet you have the decree printed on business cards so you can carry them in your wallet.

I doubt that you will find a SINGLE person on here who will believe there was a single LINE in your decree about getting money from your ex that you have not committed to MEMORY!
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 08:00 PM

He does pay Susan.. He paid SS, he paid CS and he is constantly being hit for more $$ for this/that....

I tell ya this... forgo the activities that he is NOT ordered to pay.. and then ask him about this new "law". How about that? Will that work? OR do you want him to pay you CS, 1/2 of activities AND the new law?
+++++++

Yes, I want him to pay CS which is based on LESS than he actually earns, 1/2 of agreed-upon activities and follow the law as far as how medical expenses are split.

Keep in mind, our combined income now exceeds the upper limits of our state's guidelines. In cases like ours, judges set CS at their discression, but it CANNOT be lower than the highest amount of CS awarded per the guidelines.

If we went to court, I'm very certain his CS woudl be significantly higher.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 08:02 PM

If he wants to contribute more to the kids, let him do it but not by court order. You've always made him out to be a great father and financial contributor without asking, so why not give him the benefit of the doubt?
++++++

I might just do that. I might not say a word for a few months and then ask him to split the braces in ratio to income. If he agrees, then great. Problem solved. If he doesn't, I'm going to suggest mediation.
Posted by: Stirling

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 08:10 PM

"I don't think I would pursue this any further than mediation."

Susan, there is nothing to mediate since your divorce agreement is very clear on how medical expenses are to be divided. You and your Ex in good faith entered into your divorce agreement based on the "guidelines" at the time of your divorce which did not provide for pro-rata sharing of medical expenses. The agreement that you signed in good faith should supercede any changes that have been made to the guidelines.

Also, if you intend to mediate in good faith, what do younintend to bargan with? There needs to be something in it for your Ex in order to get him to the table.
Posted by: Cassie23

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/04/06 08:16 PM

I think that's the best way to handle it if you want to keep a good relationship with him- which you have done thus far.

**But I will say with your ex having a new woman in his life- it will be certain that she will have some say in what he decides to do... It just happens that way. Kind of like you asking some of those questions of behalf of your fiancee~

Like I said my DH's ex did the same thing you are looking to do and she won, hands down, because it was according to state guidelines. Seems as though it is difficult to get divorce decrees changed, however where the state guidelines weren't truly followed- I guess its easier than some would think.

But then again, maybe it depends on the judge (their judge was a royal b!tch- and is known to favor women)- we have seen some crazy rulings. You may get in there (if mediation doesn't work) and the judge may say tough sh!t you agreed to the 50/50.

My DH's income is over the state guidelines too and ex agreed to stop it there SINCE her lawyer suggested that her chances of getting the right percentage for anything past $80k would be difficult. Sometimes there is fairness in the world- now if that woman who actually get a real job and make some money to support her kid(s), the world would be a better place!!!
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 08:22 PM

Susan, there is nothing to mediate since your divorce agreement is very clear on how medical expenses are to be divided. You and your Ex in good faith entered into your divorce agreement based on the "guidelines" at the time of your divorce which did not provide for pro-rata sharing of medical expenses. The agreement that you signed in good faith should supercede any changes that have been made to the guidelines.
+++++++

It would it be following the dispute resolution rules that are in our CO. Before we can return to court for any modification, we must first mediate.

Also, I'm not sure what you mean when you say that there has to be something in it for the ex to get him to the table.

There doesn't have to be something "in it" for the other party to return to court to seek modification.

It's just that our CO says we must first try mediation prior to returning to court for any matter.
Posted by: nrvouswrk

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 08:44 PM

Susan, do you ever worry that maybe your ex might reach a point where he has had enough, and decides to take YOU to court? Did I understand correctly that he is now engaged? His new wife might put her foot down on all the money you try and get from him.

I do hava a couple of questions...how old are your girls, and up until what age does you ex have to pay support on them? Was he also ordered to pay part of their college costs?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 08:51 PM

What would he take me to court for? CS is figured on 100% of my income and on less than 100% of his income. He doesn't want custody.

So, where is "all of this money I try to get from him." He's paying per guidelines.

My girls are 15 and 12. In Colorado they pay until the kids are 19. We agreed to split college expenses 50/50 after the Pre-paid tuition program that MY PARENTS paid for picks up their tuition.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 08:54 PM

Maybe he would like to quit paying for anything after Age 19. After all, if you can get things changed, he shold be able to also. He should only have to do "guidelines" too.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 09:09 PM

Yes, but the guidelines address College expenses. It basically says that if the parties agreed to them in the CO, then that's the way it is. It also says that a person can't be ordered to pay for college expenses AND child support...one or the other.

That is not in direct conflict like it is with what my CO and the guidelines say about med. expenses.

However, you are correct. It would certainly be his or my perrogative to go back and try to get the college part thrown out.

However, I would be the one more than likely to do it. If he's making 4 times what I make, splitting college 50/50 would certainly be much harder on me than on him.
Posted by: M5M5

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 09:24 PM

So you would make him pay for all college?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 09:26 PM

Well, considering that my side of the family is paying for ALL of their tuition for 4 years, I'd think he could pick up the books and share in room & board with me in ratio to income.
Posted by: Miranda

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 09:33 PM

You just said it was 50/50 for college and why is he held to an agreement at the time of divorce but not you?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 09:44 PM

I'm not saying he will be held to it. It's certainly his perrogative to return to court and try to get it modified. We both have the right to do that at any time about any part of the CO we don't like. Doesn't say we'll win or lose, but we are both free to try.
Posted by: M5M5

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 09:45 PM

Personally that is the dumbiest thing you can have in a CO..paying for college expenses.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 10:06 PM

Dumbiest? :)

I agree. "If I had known then what I know now..."

I remember signing my decree that night. It was the night before our court date. Our lawyers had us each in seperate rooms, going back and forth. It was taking HOURS and we were each paying something like $300 an hour to our lawyers.

We were stuck on several items...one big one to me was him committing to never taking the kids around his father. Another was him providing baby sitters if he couldn't exercise his parenting time...because I was taking night classes and was counting on him taking the kids while I was in class. I forget what the others were...but at the very LAST minute, they threw in the 50/50 college expenses. I remember fighting it...wanting "in ratio to income", but it was the last item on the table and I just felt like getting it over with. I remember reluctantly agreeing to it. I remember how totally frazzled everyone was at the time.

I honestly have NO recollection of how the 50/50 medical got in there...I don't remember agreeing to it...and I do remember that the guidelines said "in ratio to income."

Our decree is like 30 pages long, so I guess I just missed it...and with tension so high and both of us trying to avoid court the next day AND getting our lawyers off of the clock, I'm sure we both signed off on things that have come back to haunt us now.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 10:18 PM

Susan, you can afford to pay half medical and half college. Just suck it up and stop being so anal. Let the kids get JOBS to help with college like many kids will have to do.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 10:21 PM

Yes, IF I can afford to pay half medical, I'd have no problem doing so. It's the medical I CAN'T afford to pay 1/2 of that has me worried.
Posted by: Maury

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 10:30 PM

First, if you were going to give up spousal support, you certainly should have negotiated a new arrangement on the medical expenses as well. I am sur ethe ex would have jumped at it.

Even with that said, contributions to a child's medical care is usually considered a form of child supoprt. As a result, it canbe modified when there is a substantial change in circumstance. You appear to have that even itf it was voluntary. It may be worth it to file a Motion in that regard.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 10:45 PM

Is that a motion I can file by myself or do I need a lawyer?
Posted by: Maury

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 10:52 PM

There are likely forms available from your court adminstrator's office.
Posted by: LeAnne

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 10:54 PM

Isn't this kid covered under insurance? If you have dental, they will cover most all of the surgery and at least 1500.00 on the braces. Braces cost around 4500.00 average. That leaves 3000.00 to pay for, split in 1/2, that's 1500.00. Oral surgey depending on what's done, insurance should cover most, they did on SS's. Even if you have a 1000.00 to pay after the insurance, your share is 500.00. Your total cost is 2000.00 out of pocket. How much did you spend on your last vacation? How much are you spending on the wedding? I think your complaining to the wrong people about anything, knowing that you got 3300.00 a month in alimony, plus how much CS? If I got that kinda cash, I wouldn't be b!tching about nothing, gosh I wouldn't have even asked for the extras. Better eat your cake quick, because the icing is coming off the top.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 10:55 PM

[quote]Yes, IF I can afford to pay half medical, I'd have no problem doing so. It's the medical I CAN'T afford to pay 1/2 of that has me worried. [/quote]

For the millionth time - 'what ifs' will drive you insane! Quit harping on them. Ex 'might' be hit by a bus tomorrow, your house 'might' burn down today, your child 'might' die tomorrow and you wont have to worry about medical (but by all means get the pay stubs and calculators out so you can figure to the penney how much 'he' owes 'you' for the funeral). Tons of things 'might' happen - you can't bank on them all.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/04/06 11:41 PM

Avaya,

dangit.. there goes my New England Clam chowder all over the computer! ROFL.....
Posted by: rschiller

What I want to know is.......... - 10/05/06 12:13 AM

What does this Susan's husband do for a living? Where does he live? And heck, he ain't married again yet is he?

Dog gone.....

Your spousal support is more than I make after twenty five years of teaching. I really am in the wrong line of work, and durnit, I work durn hard too.

Seems to me like the guy is getting slammed coming and going. The spousal support stops, but the child support goes up. Can't win. Some states I tell ya.

Should live her in TX Susan, they have spousal support that last only up to three years, and most often it is not even issued. Most women they say......."Tough Nookies". Child support is also capped at fifteen hundred a month, no matter how much buckage you make, copays, medical, all fifty fifty, no other option. Child care, extras, college, forget all of it my sweet.

Open your eyes. I don't know you at all Susan, but after reading all of this.........you sound like a spoiled brat with too much money.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What I want to know is.......... - 10/05/06 12:34 AM

Yes, it's like that in Texas. In Georgia and several other states, it would 25% of his income...about $3500 a month in CS instead of well under $2000. You can't hold the state of Texas as the ruler that all others must be measured against.

I've toyed with many other state calculators and he would be paying much more in CS in many other states.
Posted by: Cassie23

Re: What I want to know is.......... - 10/05/06 12:39 AM

...But Susan didn't you say that your state capped income at a certain percentage too?
Posted by: rschiller

Re: What I want to know is.......... - 10/05/06 12:54 AM

[quote]Yes, it's like that in Texas. In Georgia and several other states, it would 25% of his income...about $3500 a month in CS instead of well under $2000. You can't hold the state of Texas as the ruler that all others must be measured against.

I've toyed with many other state calculators and he would be paying much more in CS in many other states. [/quote]


You missed the point completely which I am beginning to understand you do often..........

Texas svcks for divorced CP parents, usually women.

AND, you must really be stuck on how much money he is paying if you are actually calculating how much you could get other places.

I agree with whom ever else said, "Be happy he is paying, and paying the amount he is with out grief".
Posted by: jsp

Re: What I want to know is.......... - 10/05/06 12:58 AM

Susan,

Your parents paid for the prepaid, not you, so why should your ex take on more of the college expenses. Your parents money isn't your money so those costs should be split equally.

I also don't understand your comments with the expectation of % by income. You got allimony to better yourself, which you have done. If you choose a career that isn't paying as much as your're ex's, that is your issue to support yourself and you've been divorced long enough that your expectation to continue to assist in support for you is unreasonable. If you wanted to maintain a lifestyle at his income, you should have stayed married for the money.

I just don't get why adults expect to maintain their SOL if they divorce, lose their job, etc. You'll just have to learn to budget like the rest of us... like others said, cut back on vacations, etc. When I went to college, my parents spent NOTHING on themselves to get us through school. It's called sacrificing for your kids. Your kids have medical costs - you cut back and budget accordingly. But to have your ex pay more so you don't have to cut back is unreasonable, especially how much extra you charge him above child support. Child support is his portion of the child's needs, which means you need to come up with an equal portion.

Also, I don't get you with money - you're going to have lots of problems when married if you don't let go of some of this and join as a couple.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/05/06 01:12 AM

I don't understand here. Would you guys agree with splitting necessary medical expenses based on income levels if it were anyone else but Susan? Or do you disagree with doing it based on income and why? IOW: If they have a terribly ill child and one earns minimum wage, does it benefit the child to live in poverty, perhaps have no home to live in, by putting that one parent in the poorhouse?
Posted by: Gecko

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/05/06 01:26 AM

I'm laughing so damn hard right now, that there is just no way I continue to read all the response and still breath.

Susan...you are priceless; and I don't mean that in a monatary way, but in a "obtuse...kama is a greedy b1tch" way.

And I think this would be a good time for you to return my goat since you are obviously going bankrupt and will soon be living on the streets and I don't want to have to call GPS (again) on your duck-ass! Yes...I called them about you getting my goat drunk, but they said that that was a "lifestyle" choice.

Anyhoo...I'm just amazed at what you have been saying, not because of WHAT you have been saying which is just typical "Susan" crap, but that you actually BELIEVE that you are the victim here!

1. You KNEW that the alimony was TEMPORARY. That its purpose was to allow you time in which to become self-sufficent. That you choose a different path is soley YOUR responsibility.

2. You can whine all you want about how much money he earns in comparison to you, but AGAIN...YOUR choice NOT to pursue a career/education that would allow you to earn more than you do ONCE alimony ended. Also, while he does EARN more and most likely always will, I'm quite sure...knowing you, that that was taken into consideration during the property settlement. Also...it's called DIVORCE. You NO longer have a right to HIS income, HIS property, HIS retirement, HIS life, HIS anything! Get used to it.

3. NOT your ex-husband's responsibility that you are choosing to marry a man who's income is LESS than your alimony, but then again...your alimony was going to be ending anyway.

4. You CAN take it to court, but dogs to donuts you'll lose and in addition to your attorney's fees and court costs, you can pay HIS attorney's fees for bringing forth such a frivolous action. And yes it IS fivolous...NOBODY twisted your arm, NOBODY lied to you. You AGREED to the terms of the divorce and it's WAY to late to cry.

Suck it up...it's called "life".
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/05/06 01:31 AM

ROFL.. GPS!!! You are hilarious sometimes Gecko! That was priceless!
Posted by: jsp

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/05/06 01:36 AM

[quote]I don't understand here. Would you guys agree with splitting necessary medical expenses based on income levels if it were anyone else but Susan? Or do you disagree with doing it based on income and why? IOW: If they have a terribly ill child and one earns minimum wage, does it benefit the child to live in poverty, perhaps have no home to live in, by putting that one parent in the poorhouse? [/quote]

It's a little different if there were an ill child, but this isn't the case. To me, you either get a % of the NCP income and that should cover everything as that is the NCP's share or you agree to split all costs 50/50% as you both are the parents. To have to pay % of income for child support and extra for activities on the CP's time and medical is just crazy. A good example of why it shouldn't be done that way is M5's situation. At some point enough is enough and reality is if you are divorced, both parents SOL is going to decrease and they will BOTH have to adjust. You cannot maintain two households at the same SOL as one.

The % of income isn't fair, like Susan, my husband's ex got alimony, which he paid years past he had to... they both had enough time to get back on their feet and get a decent career... my husband's ex decided she wanted to work for the past 10 years as a head cashier at Walmart. That was her choice, which is fine, but if she choose not to take the opportunity to better herself, then she has to take the financial burden. Post divorce, my husband got his college degree, which is why he makes more money. Life is about choices, choices have consequences good or bad... if you made a bad choice.. tuff, live with it. And, that means, your ex shouldn't support you forever as you are too lazy to better yourself given you had the opportunity and financial support to do so.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/05/06 02:06 AM

Disagree, ill child or not. Medical "necessity" (which I stated) isn't anything at all like M5. There, they're talking about lots of extra curricular and chiropractic. Here, we're talking medical "needs" (regular doctor's, covered under insurance, but with copays and deductibles). And those are not covered under CS or "a % of the NCP income and that should cover everything." Because you could have 2 NCPs with similar incomes, and one have a child who needs $500/yr. in medical and one have a child who needs $50,000/yr. in medical. IMHO, if an NCP makes $200K/yr. and their ex makes $30K/yr. and their child needs $50K in medical in a year and they feel they should only pay half, they're a sorry SOB of a parent who should be horsewhipped by any good parent who catches sight of them. I'd kick their a$$ myself.
Posted by: jsp

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/05/06 03:02 AM

Most likely if you have a parent making $200,000 that parent is going to provide pretty good insurance. None of the situations presented here are even close to that situation. In Susan's case, they are normal medical issues. If anything if they are split, the NCP should get a credit as a portion of the child support should be used for medical needs.

Just because a NCP makes $200,000, which in our area is middle class/comfortable but not living lavishly, it doesn't mean the ex should benefit that much given they only make $30,000.

If a CP wants an equal lifestyle, they need to earn it. If they want the child to live in an equivalent lifestyle, then let the child live with the NCP. Both parents should provide an equal amount for a child. I think its gross that many states use child support to equalize the living standards by both parents. If you as a parent divorce and your income is lower, then you need to change your living standards to fit your income rather than relying on an ex to continue to support you.

Maybe it is just how my parents raise me - to be self-sufficient and not rely on a man to take care of me. Being married is wonderful and the double income is great, but bottom line, if my husband died or left tomorrow, I'd be ok. I may not be able to keep the house, etc., but you adjust your lifestyle to fit your budget.

You act like a NCP who pays child support and 1/2 the medical isn't contributing. What about large sums of child support where the CP doesn't contribute a dime extra? CP's 1/2 is being paid by child support so bottom line is NCP is paying 100% depending on how you look at it. Susan can take the child support to pay her 1/2 the child's medical needs. Dad pays the child support which pays Susan's 1/2 and then pays an additional 1/2 on top of that. That may be ok to you, but not to me. Both parents should contribute from their income and child support is not income for a CP.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What I want to know is.......... - 10/05/06 11:37 AM

...But Susan didn't you say that your state capped income at a certain percentage too?
+++++++

No, I never said that. My state does not cap. There is an upper amount of combined income...that if exceeded, it's up to the judge's discression to set CS. However, the guidelines state that he can't set CS lower than the highest amount on the CS calculator.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/05/06 11:42 AM

And, that means, your ex shouldn't support you forever as you are too lazy to better yourself given you had the opportunity and financial support to do so.
+++++++

Not quite sure I'm understanding this point. How is splitting the children's medical bills, based on ability to pay, i.e. income, "supporting me?"

I'm paying too. The money he would be paying would be going to the Dr.s, not me. I just want the bills split according to income so the burden of raising child is equitable to both of us.
Posted by: AnneB

Almostheaven - 10/05/06 12:12 PM

I am sure, based on many of the posts here, that many of these people think they should start paying more income tax. After all, why should people like my sister, someone with no kids, being paying so much more in taxes that some of the people on here with kids who use as much or not more of the government services paid for by income tax. Just because she got a degree that pays her a lot of money should not mean she should pick up the burden for them and their kids, right? They could have bettered themselves so why should those taxpayers benefit from people like my sister having bettered herself, to use their expression?

Sounds like any kind of progressive payments, paying based on what you earn, is just wrong for NCPs so it should be wrong for taxpayers too. Seriously, at least the NCPs played a role in having these people who need to be supported. People like my sister had no say in the people she is being made to support.

So, the fair thing to do for next year is just set everyone's income tax at let's say, $10K per household--doesn't matter how much you make because it is your own fault if you don't make enough. Isn't that the logic being displayed here?

Sounds like a lot of it is what my mother would have called the green eyed monster--jealousy that some get those amounts of CS when it is obviously spent on the children. If her ex was so upset about it, bet he would do something. Some people don't resent everything they do for their kids and the kids being given a nice life. And if he can't be bothered because he is busy and he wants Susan to take care of it all, why do people here care? Paying a part of their medical is not supporting Susan.

Someone said that medical should come out of CS. Hmmmm... my co-pays for the last two months have been MORE than the amount I have received in CS..so who is supporting our child?

And planning how to pay your children's medical and dental is not a what-if like saying how will you pay if your children want to go visit the international space station or something ridiculous. Not planning ahead for medical and dental can be a big problem.
Posted by: jsp

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/05/06 12:26 PM

If you are looking for equal, then you need to earn more money so you can contribute equally. At this point, he takes the financial burden of raising the children between the child support and alimony. If you get $800 per month child support, you have a $100 copay to be split equally. Your $50 can be taken out of the child support he paid to you. He not only covers his child support but an additional $50.

Nothing is equal in life. You choose to have children, you choose to raise your children and now you have to make sacrifices to pay for those children. If you wanted things equal or a comfortable lifestyle that you were able to have during marriage, you should have stayed with him (not to say cheating is ok or to tolorate it or what ever the reason for divorce was), but you are expecting things to stay the same and reality is it cannot and will not.

You are getting married.. that is your husband and your partnership. You need to join together figure this out together. Your financial reliance and expectations for your ex are unreasonable. To expect you both to have equal amounts of money is silly. He makes signficiantly more than you and he should have a lifestyle accordingly. If he wants to spend the money on the kids, great, but if he doesn't he shouldn't be forced or negociated into doing things that you may or may not have done in marriage. Likewise, if you get money from your parents - that is not YOUR share, that is a gift to the children from their grandparents and the rest be worked out between the parents. To say your ex should cover anything above your parents contribution to me is very selfish. If he offers and is willing, great, but you should demand it.

You also expect to give your kids a childhood that you have. If you can do that, its great, if not you need to raise your children in a lifestyle that you can afford without expecting or demanding help when you cannot do everything yourself. For us, we may not be able to do everything for our future kids that I/we got... that's ok with me as we do the best we can given the financial means that we have.

If you have major medical and college expenses coming up, you cut back like others pointed out - no cars for the kids - that $8000 can go to college and the kids drive your cars. No fancy trips with the kids or you wait till college is paid off, like my parents did. Maybe it was just my parents but before college time, the cut back everything... when my sister went to college, everything got cut back, including having a maid once a week. And, when we graduated with masters... then my parents jumped for joy and got their new cars, matching furniture and go on their nice vacations.

Your marriage is going to be a disaster if you have these expectations for your husband and are this petty with money. I hope this work out for you, but this nickle and diming everything I know would drive me crazy if I was married to someone like that.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Susan, think of it this way... - 10/05/06 01:25 PM

your new husband and his ex. She wants more money now for their kids because she just discovered that 50/50 split on medical bills isn't fair because their incomes aren't 50/50.

So, she goes back to court and asks for a change more in line to "state guidelines" and your new hubby is out $500 or more a month.

I don't think you would be a happy camper because YOUR household would now have less money.

And, if you think splitting all the household bills 50/50 is going to be fair between you and new hubby - you are crazy. Shouldn't the income ratio apply to that too? Actually, you should pay more because you will have your children living there using more of everything!!!

Edit - there are 3 of you and only one of him so maybe you should pay 75% of household expenses.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/05/06 01:51 PM

You are getting married.. that is your husband and your partnership. You need to join together figure this out together. Your financial reliance and expectations for your ex are unreasonable. To expect you both to have equal amounts of money is silly
+++++++++

JSP, I'm sooo confused! Where did I ever even insinuate that I want anything to be equal? Where did I ever say that I think our lifestyles should be equal??

I don't feel that way. The word I used was EQUITABLE...meaning that the burden of the expenses of the children should be EQUITABLE on both of us...i.e. in ratio to our ability to pay.

I DON'T think anything should be equal.

I never expected our lives to stay the same. In fact, I knew if I wanted them to, it would be me who would have to go out and make more money...and I've done that.

Actually, the money my parents spent on the kids college was "my" money. It was from an account ear-marked for me. So, it's that much money I'm not getting...and it's that much money that my ex doesn't have to pay.

I think it's selfish of him to take the money from me/my parents and then still expect me to pay 1/2...that would mean I'm paying almost everything, and he's paying very little when you look at the overall contributions from him.

And lastly, I've never nickel and dimed my ex. Never.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/05/06 02:02 PM

[quote]Avaya,

dangit.. there goes my New England Clam chowder all over the computer! ROFL..... [/quote]

Glad I could help! LOL
Posted by: Avaya

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/05/06 02:11 PM

More than $500 a month in extra curriculars is nickle and diming IMO.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/05/06 02:47 PM

Ok, here's what I've decided to do...

And thanks to all who took the time to respond...

I'm going to leave it be at this point in time.

Currently, my kids don't exceed more than a few hundred dollars a year in medical costs. The only time I've ever even asked my ex to pay his 50% was this year when my D12 got glasses. By the time it was all said an done, it was $750 out of pocket...and I did ask him for his half. However, the insurance company sent back an overpayment to me of $140 that ex would have never known about. I showed him the refund check and promptly handed him a check for $70 for his 1/2 of the overpayment.

As much as some of you think I nickel and dime him and don't play fair...I ALWAYS play fair with him and that's why we've had an amicable relationship for so long now.

My D12's braces are going to be about $3000 out of pocket. That would be $1500 each. If I fought the 50/50 split and won, the braces would cost me 35% or $1050. Is this battle worth $450? No, it's not. $450 is not worth the ill-will or the pot-stirring it would cause.

So, I'm going to let sleeping dogs lie, UNLESS, God-forbid, something really bad happened and the costs became huge. At that point I would probably return to court and ask for some relief based on the huge disparity of income. But until that happens, I think I will save the battle for something bigger.

By the way, when we were on the phone a few days ago, going back and forth about what his new CS would be, we were getting a little argumentative...and I said "come on, Bob, you know I spend every dime on the kids...and even spent most of my alimony on them too." He said "Yeah, I have to admit everytime I'm over there I can see...there's nothing the kids don't have. There's nothing they want to do that you don't find a way..." So that was nice to hear.
Posted by: Emily67

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/05/06 03:05 PM

Susan,

I think that's a great decision and a wise one. $450.00 is not worth drama between exs over money. As far as God forbid, a tragedy which would bring on high medical expenses, I would hope you both would do right by your children and I am sure you would.

Nice to have the ex acknowledge you like that. Money can always be a prickly subject no matter how good the relationship. I know that my ex thinks he can even comment on finances when he is way in arrears and hasn't even paid...for example, he had the nerve to make a negative comment about me getting our son a cell phone when he doesn't even contribute financially.

Nice when exs can and will work together! Hats off to both of you!
Posted by: Lucy44

Where have I been?? - 10/05/06 03:37 PM

"I said she was marrying him for his health insurance and ability to watch her D while she works and goes to school at night."

They're getting married now?? And you know that the above statement is true?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Where have I been?? - 10/05/06 03:48 PM

"I said she was marrying him for his health insurance and ability to watch her D while she works and goes to school at night."

They're getting married now?? And you know that the above statement is true?
+++++++

They are engaged and supposedly getting married next summer.

Yes, I believe what I said is true based on several factors.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: What should I do? Maury - 10/05/06 04:06 PM

[quote] The only time I've ever even asked my ex to pay his 50% was this year when my D12 got glasses. By the time it was all said an done, it was $750 out of [/quote]

That is OUTRAGEOUS. He was VERY generous by agreeing to pay half of that. I would NEVER have agreed to pay half of $750 for glasses for a CHILD (or even an adult). Does she have some sort of optical abnormality that deserve such an expensive pair of glasses????

[quote]As much as some of you think I nickel and dime him and don't play fair...I ALWAYS play fair with him and that's why we've had an amicable relationship for so long now.[/quote]

I suspect he's just clueless, that's why he's so amicable. If he's ever enlightened (as he soon may be with this new shack up honey), you better watch out.

[quote]My D12's braces are going to be about $3000 out of pocket. That would be $1500 each. If I fought the 50/50 split and won, the braces would cost me 35% or $1050. Is this battle worth $450? No, it's not. $450 is not worth the ill-will or the pot-stirring it would cause.[/quote]

Good, you finally see what we have all been saying all along. Congratulations.


[quote]By the way, when we were on the phone a few days ago, going back and forth about what his new CS would be, we were getting a little argumentative...and I said "come on, Bob, you know I spend every dime on the kids...and even spent most of my alimony on them too." He said "Yeah, I have to admit everytime I'm over there I can see...there's nothing the kids don't have. There's nothing they want to do that you don't find a way..." So that was nice to hear. [/quote]

Okay, except you are probably spoiling them unmercifully! Like I said, he's just clueless.
Posted by: Emily67

Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 04:18 PM

I thought the total out of pocket for medical expenses was $750.00...was that total or just for glasses?

I'm confused.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 04:30 PM

I understood it to be for the glasses - but if I read it wrong, forgive my rant. :-)
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 04:30 PM

It was $750 for the exam, glasses, lenses, etc... Total out-of-pocket...and it was for both daughter's exams that day, one daughter's glasses. We have lousy eye insurance.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 04:34 PM

Even without insurance, I have never experienced that kind of cost for an exam and glasses. Not ever. You either are so spoiled that you had to get the most expensive thing you could find (after all, YOU didn't have to pay for all of it, you could count on someone else paying for half) or you are so ignorant that you were taken WAY advantage of. I will BET that is NOT the going price for the average pair of glasses (and lenses and exams) in your area. No way.

My original rant stands!
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Susan - - 10/05/06 04:40 PM

Your medical insurance will have a cap on it about out of pocket expenses. Most are $5,000 so divided 50/50, that would be $2,500 each. Not bad when you consider that would be for something really, really bad.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 04:41 PM

Well, you can stick to your original rant, but until you have a child that needs special lenses, and lousy insurance, you probably won't understand why you are wrong.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 04:46 PM

Lenses $350.00
Frames $140
Exam $70 each, total $140.

Total $630.

I paid about $750. Received about $140 refund.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 04:56 PM

Igmo, that's what I asked, does she have some sort of abnormality (beyong nearsightedness or farsightedness) that would require special glasses (lenses). Sheesh I feel so sorry the for people in your life.
Posted by: Lucy44

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 05:03 PM

"Well, you can stick to your original rant, but until you have a child that needs special lenses, and lousy insurance, you probably won't understand why you are wrong."

-------------------------------

If your collective optical insurance is really that bad, you'd be better off putting your energy into sourcing out a better plan or supplement....one which would ease the burdon on both you and your ex, should something expensive come up. (including coverage for dental and medical)

Maybe Bob wouldn't mind splitting that 65:35.
Posted by: Emily67

Wow! - 10/05/06 05:06 PM

My son plays sports so I got him the flexible all over kind of glasses that Nike makes and frames, lenses, exam, everything was $350.00. He also needs adult size frames because of his size.

I just got a pair recently and the frames were Prada and I paid $341.00 for mine....

We live in one of the highest cost areas of the country also....$750.00 seems like a lot.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Wow! - 10/05/06 05:09 PM

Seemed like a lot to me too and we pay ALL of our optical expenses. I get tri-focals, those lens that get darker when you go outside, frame and exam fees and it is never more than $250.
Posted by: M5M5

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 05:24 PM

Yeah that makes no sense. Got my SS and SD 2 pairs of glasses for $183..and that included insurance, lens cleaner, etc. The glasses were 2 for $99 at Dr. Bizer's.
Posted by: M5M5

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 05:26 PM

We got the kids $1.00 eye exams at Dr. Bizers. They were running a special. Before that..when we took them to an opthalmologist..total out of pocket was $15 per child.
Posted by: LeAnne

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 05:34 PM

Yes, but Susan's eye doc, come with a personal massage, pedicure, manicure, champagne, and those nasty little fish eggs and crackers, while you wait. You guys are just not in style. Please get with the program. LOL HeHe
Posted by: M5M5

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 05:56 PM

um, I'll pass on the fish eggs!!! LOL!
Posted by: youngatheart

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 06:44 PM

In Susan's defense, I have a funky prescription on my glasses. I cannot get glasses ANYWHERE cheapter than around $300-350. That doesn't include the insurance (usually another $70-80, lenses that will tint so I don't need sunglasses, etc. And that doesn't include the eye doctor visit, which I believe is around $90 for my doctor, more if they dialate the eyes.

It's freaking rediculous, but very necessary for my vision. I just thank God that my daughter doesn't have the same issues. Her glasses and appointments are expensive enough!
Posted by: Gecko

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 07:37 PM

I agree. My Vision Insurance isn't all that great and it says right in the plan that if you can get a better deal during some "special", you might as well take it.

So long as I go through an "approved" provider...eye exam is 100% covered; Lenses...between $56 for "single vision" up to $116 for "trifocal"; Frames...$75. Speaking of "frames"...ever see what $75 Frames look like? Not only are they pretty damn ugly, but they're cheap and that's a problem when your insurance will NOT replace broken lenses or frames.

My vision is different in each eye, plus I need bi-focals. I pay EXTRA for scratch-resistent coating, titatium frames and a slight tint. Considering that my insurance will ONLY pay for ONE exam and ONE pair of glasses every TWO year...it's worth the extra money.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Vision different in each eye.... - 10/05/06 08:08 PM

you mean like near sighted in one and far sighted in the other? That is what mine are.
Posted by: Marie_ss

Re: Vision different in each eye.... - 10/05/06 09:07 PM

Gecko and Buckeye - My eyesight is the same as yours, different in each eye. I've worn bifocals for many years and decided it was time to see my golf balls leave the clubface without glasses, especially in rain. I had lasik to correct my nearsightedness only, and will always need glasses for reading. However, I no longer need prescription for this and can buy the inexpensive off-the-shelf magnifiers that you see in a lot of pharmacies. What a wonderful feeling to no longer need thick lenses (contacts or glasses) - lasik was totally worth the cost!
Posted by: matart1

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 09:18 PM

okay maybe in defense....but...

my vision is 20/180 in left eye and 20/200 in the right with what you can say is a nasty case os astigmatism that even lasik will not cure because of the contuors of my eyes and my eye exam up until last year was $40 and same exam is $15, the regular co-pay ( plan changed ) and my frames and lens I got from Sears name brand with the magnetic sunglass clip, anti-scratch, uv protection, fashion flexible twisty kind of frames with a 2 yr covered additional warranty came to just under $240 and that included all the extra little perk prices that can be added to buy frames and lens.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 09:27 PM

Ok, I tried to make a long story short, but evidentally some of you want me to make a long story long!

My ex choose the eye doctor. He loves this doctor and wanted me to take the kids to him. The kids have been to him before. I wanted to switch to my eye doctor, but really didn't care either way.

I take 1/2 a day off of work, UNPAID, because I was saving my V time for the boat trip. I pull the kids from school and take them for their appts.

I get there only to find out the eye doctor is no longer "in network." Insurance covers nothing.

I call my ex. "What do you want me to do? This Dr. isn't in network anymore...the exam is $70 each, glasses will be a few hundered if either of them need them. I really don't want to take any more time off of work. So, if I leave, then you'll need to make time to bring them next time."

We discussed it and decided it would be easier to just go ahead this one time and split the cost. That's what we did. Of course, it ended up costing much more than we anticipated...but it was what it was...and of course, we'll be using an "in network" eye doctor in the future.

Neither of us was upset because we both decided to together to go ahead with the appts. that day. We submitted the bill to our insurance and did end up getting $140 back.

But that's the story of the expensive eye doctor visit.
Posted by: youngatheart

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 09:49 PM

Thing is, everyone has a different situation. My vision is different from yours, yours is different from someone else, and theirs is different from someone elses.

I have shopped all over for glasses, and buy at the cheapest place I can find. I will be interested to see what I can get mine for in the spring, as I now have another option. My ex's cousin now runs a place that makes eye glasses for doctors. We took my daughter's prescription there this past spring, and they gave us a GREAT deal (because of my ex being related). I'm hoping they will give me a similar deal, because at this point, I seriously need a new pair of glasses, but cannot afford it.

Regarding my daughter, I have spent an enormous amount of money this year on her eye appointments because she has a lazy eye, and had to go see the eye doctor every 4-6 weeks for a check-up and/or adjustment.
Posted by: youngatheart

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 09:50 PM

Susan, are you adjusting the child support when your SS ends?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 10:01 PM

Yes, it's going up about $430 a month.
Posted by: youngatheart

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/05/06 11:49 PM

Then this should be discussed in the child support orders. If I were you, I would bring it up as a part of those changes.
Posted by: jsp

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/06/06 02:07 AM

I have to second Susan's defense. What she paid for a good pair of glasses is actually cheap. I spend $150-400 on frames and $350-400 on the newest high index lenses (which I had to do to go rimless) so mine can easily run $700 per pair and I like seperate glasses and sunglasses. Some brand frames you can get online for 1/2 the price - the Silhouettes my husband and I wear I got the frames online and went to our glasses shop for the lenses just in case there was a problem. One thing not to go cheap on is the frames as good frames can last if stepped on (which I do as I can't see them) or tugged by kids (never had a frame break and I've had kids tugg with a death grip). Even cheap ones are going to be about $400 at a chain glasses store given I need the high index lenses - I could get the lenses slighly cheaper online, but I don't want to mess with that. I wanted a second pair to paint, etc. but it wasn't worth the money at that point.

We wanted to buy my husband's son the frames we have (he was amazed at how light they are) - he takes decent care of his glasses so I wouldn't worry, but his ex refused the offer (we'd/I would have paid for it all).

Our vision plan only reinburses $50 per frame every two years and $50-100 for one set of lenses every year per person. The only reason why we bother with it is that the plan is so cheap through my work that doing the math we save money. I don't know about the exams, but their reinbursement is minimal as we use the military docs.
Posted by: almostheaven

And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:08 AM

every CP who gets large sums of CS doesn't spend it on their kids. Helllloooo...McFly....we weren't talking about CPs not spending CS, or am I in the wrong thread? I thought we were discussing WHY an NCP should not be expected to pay medical expenses as a PERCENTAGE (not just half), just like their CS is figured? For one, that IS how the court sets it. So I'm trying to wrap my mind around why you, and others, think it should be different, and why you think you have a better handle on this system than the courts and lawmakers do. Because I think splitting it by income is a good way to go. Now...you could get into that further. If one parent refuses to use all the CS appropriately or refuses to work to their full potential...then I'd have something different to say about those "individual" cases. But as a whole, ANY NCP who feels they should pay only half of medical KNOWING the CP makes WAAAAAAAAAY less than they do, and KNOWING it would put the CP and child(ren) in the poorhouse...that's not a parent. That's an a$$.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: I feel bad for her ex... - 10/06/06 02:11 AM

>>>>>Nothing is equal in life. You choose to have children, you choose to raise your children and now you have to make sacrifices to pay for those children. If you wanted things equal or a comfortable lifestyle that you were able to have during marriage, you should have stayed with him (not to say cheating is ok or to tolorate it or what ever the reason for divorce was), but you are expecting things to stay the same and reality is it cannot and will not.<<<<<

Oh I get it. It's not equal. HE didn't choose to have children, HE didn't choose to have her raise them, HE didn't choose to make sacrifices by possibly having his wife stay home and not pursue a career while he worked hard at his - knowing in the event of a divorce, he'd foot the larger share financially, and HE never causes the breakup of the marriage. Thanks for clarifying.
Posted by: jsp

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:15 AM

If a CP gets child support that is set by the standard, they should pay all expenses while that child is in their home. Or, don't do child support and share all expenses. Why do incomes have to be equal??? If one parent makes less and feels they are entitled to more - GET A JOB or get a better job. At some point enough is enough. If a CP wants to soley dictate how child support is spent when child support is for the child and the NCP's money, then they have no right to ask for more. What is the point of child support if everything except food and shelter are considered extras and have to be paid upon demand???

In some situations that is how the court sets it, in others it isn't. It's not how my husband's is set.

Likewise, if a CP makes so much less that even with child support they cannot afford the child/ren, maybe they shouldn't be the CP.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 02:16 AM

You ever notice that the only people who argue so hard about not paying based on income are those that are paying? And the same ones who claim they'd do ANYTHING for their kids. Yet they're so hot to get out of paying any dime they can that it leaves me wondering how many of them would REALLY pay any support if they weren't forced to. I know a lot of people claim they would, many would throw a fit and a "HOW DARE YOU INSINUATE" routine about this. But truly, I DO wonder. I've seen too many (IN REAL LIFE) to know better. I've seen those that do try and do the right thing, but they are TRULY few and far between. Most people just give lip service to it. And the harder they argue to get out of paying a dime towards their kids, the more I feel they're headed towards the lip service category.
Posted by: AnneB

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:18 AM

I think the reason the law allows for medical to be separate is that it is such an unknown and such a variable. It is ridiculous to say medical is in included in CS when one child may go to the doctor once a year and another may go twice a week. In that case the NCP would not be supporting the child at all if medical was not paid in addition to CS because the CS would all be going to pay medical bills. Evidently it is logical to a lot of people since so many state laws require that a portion of medical be paid in addition to CS.
Posted by: jsp

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 02:19 AM

And at what point, is enough enough with child support and extra's. If a state sets a rate for foster care that a child can be reasonable supported with no foster parent contribution, then why is it ok for a NCP to pay 2-4 times more in child support and still be expected to pay extra's. At what point, is enough enough? If you cannot afford to parent your kids, especially with child support, then maybe you shouldn't parent those kids.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:19 AM

Because CS does NOT cover all expenses. CS is for BASICS. SOME children have more needs than BASICS. THAT is why the courts allow for daycare and medical and insurance as EXTRAS. And THOSE are based on income JUST the same as CS is. And if one parent didn't sometimes EXPECT the other parent to run right out and earn the same thing they do the moment they found a hot younger thing to satisfy them, knowing the other parent had been an SAHP for many many years and could NOT earn even NEAR what they did, then they wouldn't have to argue so vehemently for paying as little as they could towards their children...towards their decisions too.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:20 AM

I think she knows that and it's getting to the point that she's purposely ignoring it.
Posted by: jsp

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:22 AM

In your situaiton to get extra help is reasonable but within reason depends on your ex's income and how much he pays in child support. But, in situations where the child goes a few times a year, to share in those costs is silly as child support should cover reasonable medical care. But, if the state takes a flat % from the NCP, then that needs to be considered. If a parent is paying 1/2 their pay check to child support and the child's needs in their home, and you sock them with another few hundered a month, how do they eat and pay their basic bills? I understand you don't want to make the CP broke, but at some point their has to be a balance and basic medical care should be included as part of the child support assuming the child goes to the doctor a few times a year and may or may not need glasses or braces.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 02:23 AM

If you can't parent your kids and have to hand them off to your spouse to do it, then you can't parent...period. And maybe one should think about that before having SAHPs, or having the spouse do the lion's share of child rearing, or before divorcing.

And hon, foster care pays way more than a mere check. I don't think you really wanna go there. Unless you want your husband to start providing his kids with clothing vouchers, free lunches, medical cards, etc. etc.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:26 AM

If CS and medical are set as a percentage of income, the same formula is used to set the percent for BOTH the CP and NCP. So if they can't pay their basic bills, they may have a child simply too sick that they need some help with the situation...and possibly couldn't have handled it if they'd stayed together. And in THIS situation, we're talking a 6 figure earner. Do you really think they can't pay basic bills because they pay 65% instead of 50% towards medical?
Posted by: jsp

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:26 AM

So tell me then why isn't my husband ordered to pay extra's that you demand? He is required to pay 1/2 medical, but with tricare there are no copays, so if mom chooses not to use his court ordered insurance, she has to pay full costs. The only thing ordered is 1/2 braces, but she doesn't want to pay her share, so no braces (we were willing ot pay cash up front). No child care was ordered either!

Child support and a parent cheating on each other have nothing to do with each other! And, if a CP had common sense, they know throughout a marriage not to rely on another person to financially provide for their child - if they get the help, great, if not, do what you need to do and support your child.

So, in come cases depending on the state, it is ordered, but in others, many I know of, it is a flat rate and that is it in less the NCP chooses to do more.
Posted by: jsp

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 02:32 AM

Humm... hello, I know my husband offers free medical care, basic dental is covered fully by mom's insurance and the clothing allowances here are about $100 a year... not much of everything. And, at one point in one year, we provided about 25-30 teeshirts, 4-6 sweatshirts, 10-12 pair of jeans, 3 pairs of sneakers and a lot of other crap.. that is way more than any clothing allowance would provide. Maybe your foster kids get much more, but ours don't. But, I guess I wouldn't know anything about that given I was a foster care worker for about 7 years post masters (3 years with internships at 24 hours per week). The only thing our foster kids got were decent X-mas/holiday gifts and that depended on if they had a social worker who could be bothered to take the time to put in lists, pick up and drop off the gifts.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 02:38 AM

Good for you. Trying doing foster care in other states. Or are you assuming that EVERYONE should live like you and that ALL states are exactly alike?
Posted by: almostheaven

Yayyyyyy, she finally gets it... - 10/06/06 02:40 AM

Because "in some cases" and "depending on the state". And Susan's state says as a "percentage of income". And you're STILL vehemently arguing that it shouldn't apply to someone else because you don't think it should apply in YOUR case. Why? Again I ask. Because it's Susan?
Posted by: jsp

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 02:40 AM

I've done it in three states and D.C. All states have basic standards to be compliant with the feds who provide a good chunk of money to the states in block grants. If you are not in compliance you don't get the money.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 02:42 AM

Well my aunt and cousin do it in OH, and my grandmother and friends have done it in WV. And they all received extras in addition to a check every month. They got foodstamps and medical cards for the foster kids, free lunches and clothing vouchers. For babies, they are even provided with furniture. I don't recall if that is in the form of vouchers or how they go about getting it, but they get cribs.
Posted by: jsp

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 02:49 AM

No cribs or anything else in the states I worked in. Here you can get car seats for low income families if the social worker has a clue how to do it or a clue to tell families about it but they usually will not give them to foster parents (once foster mom and I went with a mom to get new car seats as mom needed the kids with her and between the two women there were too many kids for them to get trained and care for the kids so I went - to be decent they gave foster mom one car seat as she just got a new placement and hadn't had time to get a properly fitting car seat). When I asked if they'd do it for all foster parents, they said NO nor would they give me one for the agency even after they saw the one I had in my car that didn't meet standards in terms of it's age and other issues.

We can use other foster parents and network for things like cribs, clothing, etc which I have done but I'm one of the few workers I know who did that and the one aide who did it provided the worst stuff so the foster parents always ended up throwing it out.

No food stamps here. You can get WIC, but food is included in the stipend.
Posted by: katiefedup

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/06/06 02:50 AM

I agree! I pay $150 for an exam 2x a year. My lenses are $175 and my frames can range from $59 to $400, depending on what I want. My insurance kicks in after $500 not including high end frames. Who wants their kids wearing Brady Bunch frames?
Posted by: jsp

Re: Yayyyyyy, she finally gets it... - 10/06/06 03:03 AM

[quote]Because "in some cases" and "depending on the state". And Susan's state says as a "percentage of income". And you're STILL vehemently arguing that it shouldn't apply to someone else because you don't think it should apply in YOUR case. Why? Again I ask. Because it's Susan? [/quote]

"My CO states that medical expenses are to be split equally. I can't believe it says that and I can't believe I agreed to it! It was never an issue before because our income was roughly equal with my receiving alimony. But now that I'm no longer receiving alimony, I dug out our CO to see what it says.

Colorado Child Support guidelines clearly state that CP pays the first $250 each year of medical expenses and then the balance is split in ratio to income. (specifially Orthodontia)"

Susan's state may say one thing on how standard is, but her court order splits it - so she has to follow the order in less her ex agrees otherwise or get it changed. So, if ex is ordered to pay 50%, why should he pay more because Susan wants in by income. Of course, if she wants to spend thousands fighting over it, she might "win" but that money would be much better spent on the medical issues.
Posted by: jsp

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/06/06 03:05 AM

[quote] Who wants their kids wearing Brady Bunch frames? [/quote]

My husband's ex... top off cheap Walmart glasses (frame style is cute - kid copied what we got my husband) with bad acne (and she will not take the child to a derm.) that is getting worse with age - poor kid.
Posted by: katiefedup

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/06/06 03:08 AM

can the father take her to the dermo?
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Yayyyyyy, she finally gets it... - 10/06/06 03:16 AM

That is because she AGREED to a difference in the order. But her state GUIDELINES state differently. And her question was not about whether she had to follow it but whether the state would change it to guidelines if she sought a mod. And most likely, being guideline...YES, they would. It won't matter a hill of beans if her ex AGREES or not.

Now as for whether it would cost a lot fighting it, that is true. But will the state agree with her...it's in her favor that they would. If her and her ex have done ok on their issues without dragging through court though, it's likely there would be no fight. He seems to care about his kids.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 03:17 AM

I really wish people wouldn't delete posts. If you said it, you meant it, whatever it was. Be brave enough to leave it.
Posted by: jsp

Re: Susan - can you clarify? - 10/06/06 03:21 AM

We tried - it's a boy, now 16, I think if it were the daughter, she'd do it. Kid told mom two years ago we had eye and doctor's appointments set up here (all free through tricare). My husband was going to do the medical and I was going to be the shopper (I could have gotten each pair of glasses (regular and sunglasses) for $250-300 given he doesn't need fancy lenses). She demanded child be sent home next day and then finally scheduled the appointments (it was bad as he told me April the day before he was leaving on Spring Break that he couldn't see well and come summer she still hadn't taken him - my husband mentioned it to her and offered to pay for the glasses/lenses if money was an issue - given we both were glasses we are very sensitive to it).

Sadly, we had to give up as when we tried to do that stuff, she'd refuse, upset the son and make him come home. The only good thing is she is very competative, so then she took care of the glasses - not what I'd get, but at least she got them. She also only bought new clothing the day before our visits (since I always overfilled the suitcase with clothing for his return trip)- I liked what she bought, but she didn't ever buy enough. I wish there were ways around it as he really needs braces too. But, the only way to deal with it is through court, and if we fought it between attorney's and travel costs, we couldn't afford the braces, glasses and other stuff. And, braces are court ordered but for what ever reason she will not get them put on.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 03:22 AM

Well dumbass...(how's that for saying it)
I was editing it... and got stuck on something else.....

what I said... and now without the edit because frankly you and your big hair ain't worth the time....

"don't you love it when people are F'ing clueless." was what I SAID.. but.... it went to the WRONG POST! I was toggling between this post and the one about NCP's.....

BUT you, have to assume it's ALL about you.. and that people can't make mistakes on their post and then try to correct it...
Posted by: jsp

Re: Yayyyyyy, she finally gets it... - 10/06/06 03:23 AM

She has to follow the order, not the guidlines!!!
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 03:40 AM

Further explanation cause Gosh knows I don't want Star Trekkie woman to call me down...... I would delete the other post to explain better.. but we have OUR rules........

I was reading two posts.. This one and the other about NCPs... I was responding to Trekkie woman actually somewhat agreeing with a comment she made..... AND instead... I commented with a post that was meant for the NCP's post... well.. realizing my mistake.. I was going to correct it... so I deleted it... and started to RE-WRITE it....

Well trekkie woman, had to post her post about people just leaving theirs... thinking (and I can understand) that my post was to her..... but instead of asking me... she just has to be her normal, rightous self. So.... there ya go... I apologize for DELETEING a post.. I guess.. Trekkie woman has spoken and we are NOT to use this function... EVEN when making a mistake.

Now.. in regards to her comment that I was going to respond too.... I disgress... it's not worth the time... trying to discuss something with a woman who thinks big hair is still in style is pointless......
Posted by: Redlegg

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 05:22 AM

I pay 500 a month for my 17 year old son, he lives with me, I pay 100% of his medical and dental. I don't agree with what she uses the money for all the time, but I kow this, as long as she has a decent place for him to visit and food to eat,then its fine. I may not like the fact that she has used that money for things not directly related to him, but it is what it is.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 10:55 AM

One of the things that every one seems to be forgetting regarding the medical 50/50 thing, is that the NCP is normally ordered to pay the costs of the all medical/dental insurance and that isn't split 50/50.

I think that is the reason the courts decide 50/50 is fair instead of doing an income ratio thing.

My SIL has to cover the costs of all medical/dental insurance costs for his kids. BM is to pay the deductible and the co-pays, then they split the co-insurance 50/50.
Posted by: AnneB

Re: Almostheaven - 10/06/06 11:10 AM

Not always in Texas. My ex's health insurance premium was deducted directly from the amount calculated for CS. So it is not in addition to anything. Not only that, the same premium covers his new child as well. So my son's CS is giving them free coverage for their child. And he doesn't pay the 50% of medical as ordered either. I know lots of people in Texas who get credit towards CS for the health insurance. That is a judge's way of making sure taxpayers are not picking up the cost for kids' health insurance, I guess. And even though my ex works for the state dependent coverage is right at $170 per month so that is a significant amount of the CS that is deducted.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 11:41 AM

think the reason the law allows for medical to be separate is that it is such an unknown and such a variable. It is ridiculous to say medical is in included in CS when one child may go to the doctor once a year and another may go twice a week.
++++++++

Colorado law is clear. The first $250 in medical expenses ARE included in CS. Any amount over that is NOT included in CS. Just as Anna said. $250 is a set amount. But any amount over that is so variable there's no way it could be built into the CS calculations.
Posted by: joan

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 01:08 PM

I thought SS is provided to give you time to catch up financially. Rather than continuing to go after "his" money, why not get a job that pays the same as his. Why not take the SS that you have been receiving and go to school? Bust your a$$ to make as much as he does. My dad when to night school for 10 years to get a good job. Stand on your own two feet.

I was with my daughter the other day and she saw a beautiful house and said "when I get married I want my husband to buy me a house like that." I told her to work hard, get a good job and buy the house for herself.

If you are concerned about your kids medical expenses, make enough money to pay for them.
Posted by: katiefedup

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 01:26 PM

she has been going to school
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:02 PM

I thought SS is provided to give you time to catch up financially. Rather than continuing to go after "his" money, why not get a job that pays the same as his. Why not take the SS that you have been receiving and go to school? Bust your a$$ to make as much as he does. My dad when to night school for 10 years to get a good job. Stand on your own two feet.
++++++++++

I'm not going after his money. I do make my own money and I do stand on my own two feet. I want him to pay for his share of our kids as the Colorado Guidelines says he should.

Him paying his fair share of the kids medical bills is hardly me going after his money.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: And you act like... - 10/06/06 02:36 PM

All this discussion about medical expenses that don't even exist and may never exist. What a waste.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 02:49 PM

you and your ex seem to have a wonderful relationship regarding the children.

Why would you think that he would try to stiff you on medical bills or anything else now?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 03:04 PM

He wouldn't stiff me on them. I just doubt he'd agree to the "in ratio to income" unless it was in the CO. In fact, I'm not even going to ask him unless the bills become significant.

Now that he has a new woman and her child to support, I sense that he'll be willing to do what he's done in the past, but will be resisting doing anything additional that he doesn't have to per the CO.

Just a hunch I'm having...which is fine. I don't plan on asking him for anything until something like prom or some other really extraordinally expensive comes up.

He's REALLY into 50/50...always has been and that was fine when our incomes were roughly equal.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 03:09 PM

no use stirring the pot until something happens. And, depending on the circumstances, it might be well not to stir the pot even then.

I know this hard for you to understand - never having been in this situation before. You will now be dealing with your fiance's ex and now maybe even a SM for your children. Just take your time and get used to everything because things are going to be a lot different from now on.

And, before you do ANYTHING, come in here and let us all "have at it". Then, you will have a better idea of what may be coming down the road toward you. Sometimes getting a little bit more money isn't worth the ill well that is created.
Posted by: Avaya

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 03:32 PM

[quote]

He's REALLY into 50/50...always has been and that was fine when our incomes were roughly equal. [/quote]

Your incomes were only 'roughly equal' because he was giving you $$ to MAKE yours equal to his. Get that through your head. You should be proud of every penny he has ever given you and you should be ashamed to ever ask for a dime more. Your incomes were NEVER equal - only manipulated to make it look equal - he was still the one EARNING the income.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 04:08 PM

Yep, and I was the one doing 90% of the parenting and raising of the children. My hours "working" for him, doing his share of the parenting, so he could be out making those big dollars, made it a very equitable situation.

Now, I'm doing 90% of the parenting, still raising his kids, freeing him up to make huge money, and for that I get child support that covers about half of the kid's expenses. He has to pay nothing extra for basically dumping his responsibilites on me, even when doing that enables him to make far more money than if he took his fair share of the parenting.
Posted by: Buckeye

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 04:24 PM

Well, the answer to this is to make him the CP and you the NCP and then you will have time to make all the big bucks!
Posted by: Marie_ss

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 05:54 PM

"My hours "working" for him, doing his share of the parenting, so he could be out making those big dollars, made it a very equitable situation."

Just curious, but isn't your husband an engineer or some kind of highly paid techie? Are you saying that if you were given that same opportunity, you would be making as much, if not more, than he? Understand that not all people have the same aptitude for techie work, so are you saying that you have the similar qualities?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 06:51 PM

No, I'm not qualified to make more than him. But if I had been free to accept jobs that involve a lot of OT and travel, I'd be making much more than I am now.
Posted by: LeAnne

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 07:31 PM

And what makes you think he has to support this handicapped child? Do you know for a fact, that Bm does not recieve CS? Do you know for a fact that she does not collect a disability check or medicaid for her D? Do you know for a fact that the BD does not have her covered on his insurance? I guess they lived in a cardboard box before she hooked up with your EX? I guess her address before she met your H, #3, cardboard box, under the overpass, next to the sewage treatment plant. I don't think you give this woman much credit? She is a very strong lady, mentally and physically, quit giving her the title of a GOLD DIGGING [censored]! Seems she has a job! No? Her D is very well taken care of? No? That's like calling all single mom's, Gold Diggers. Some of us do make our own money and support our kids just fine. Did you ever think that maybe, they like each other for who they are?
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Susan... - 10/06/06 07:51 PM

Did you ever think that maybe, they like each other for who they are?
++++++

No, I don't ever think that. Based on what I've seen...what her apartment was like as my d's described to me. The quickness of which she moved in. The number of times I've seen my ex caring for the D while M was not home.

Knowing my ex the way I do. I plain, flat out, think she's after him for his income and the lifestyle he has to offer her.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/07/06 12:07 AM

And here I had thought you were an adult. Pardon me...my mistake. ;)

Big hair? LOL I really wish I knew what you were talking about, but oh well, it won't be the first time your ranting is somewhat garbled and meaningless.

BTW, I've edited for stuff I've misspelled or omitted before, and I've never had to delete in order to edit. Maybe you just don't know how to do it properly. ;)

And yeah...if you're posting under mine, I WOULD have to assume you are speaking TO me. THAT would of course be a logical assumption. BTW, I had thought I'd told you I was partial to numbnuts and not dumbass.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/07/06 12:12 AM

I would REALLY like to know what all this "big hair" stuff is about. Making another (whoops) assumption, I would guess it is because of the picture to the left of my posts...the PHONEY picture that was made with my face only in Vegas, which has been mentioned before, but you were apparently taking a siesta that day. Not my hair. Although I've had plenty of my pics (AND my hair) here. So there's been more than one day you were taking a siesta. Since my hair is thin and flat...hangs straight. I just WISH it had body.

As for the "trekkie woman", you're living in the past when you were awake at some point, but can't recall the talk about my Vegas picture. I haven't seen an episode of ST in probably 3+ years.

Regardless...I don't care who your post was to or what it was about. When I click a post intending to read it, I expect there to be a post to read. When I click it and it says it doesn't exist, it's aggravating and leaves me wondering why people say things then delete them right after. It's really really really annoying. But hey...that's just my take on it. It doesn't annoy you when I delete my posts you click...um....because I never do that. ;)
Posted by: almostheaven

EXACTLY! - 10/07/06 12:14 AM

You don't begrudge helping with your son's costs. You DO have a problem with the other parent not using the money you provide appropriately. There's a difference IMO. I wouldn't like it either if I sent money for my child and it wasn't used appropriately, or if I was ordered to pay way more than what could reasonably be spent on a child or what could be afforded by anyone doing their best. But I would never begrudge putting money on my child when I have it and know the child benefits from it.
Posted by: almostheaven

::sigh:: You're still being obtuse... - 10/07/06 12:16 AM

I specifically said: "her question was NOT ABOUT WHETHER SHE HAD TO FOLLOW IT BUT whether the state would change it to guidelines if she sought a mod."
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: Almostheaven - 10/07/06 02:41 AM

JUST because you don't do it doesn't mean s h i t... many do... Susan deleted a post the other day after making a mistake.. instead of making a dumbass snide remark about it.. I said '''hey, Susan I was responding and it disappeared"... and she said "yeah, I deleted it"... NO F'ING BIG DEAL.

Yes, I do know how to edit, but as I said.. I got stuck on something else... and knew I woudl be on it.. so instead of waiting to edit.. I deleted it... to avoid any conflict SINCE the post was not to you anyway... as I said.... I MADE A F'ING MISTAKE.... we are allowed to do that....
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/07/06 01:15 PM

The problem with your "f'ing" mistake however is that you throw a chlidish tantrum over it. Other people HAVE deleted, and I HAVE said I hate when people delete their posts, because USUALLY it's because they want to run their mouth about something then not have the balls to stand by it. But no one else has ever thrown such a childish tantrum over it before. That's why I'm getting so amused this time.
Posted by: Susanf31

Re: Almostheaven - 10/07/06 03:26 PM

No, I ran my mouth about something and then realized I misread. Therefore, I deleted because what I had to say was wrong and it was completely irrevelant to the thread.

Sometimes it's just easier to delete and repost than edit.

I really don't care who chooses to do what.
Posted by: Runswithscissors

Re: Almostheaven - 10/07/06 11:19 PM

Are you done? Have you gotten the last word in yet? Good.. can we move on to something productive.

You find my tantrum childish.. I find your post childish about deleting.... so F'ing what... get over it... I have.
Posted by: almostheaven

Re: Almostheaven - 10/09/06 01:33 AM

LOL Really? You have? Gee...coulda fooled me. ;)