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#773090 - 03/11/17 09:15 PM Narcissistic Husband wanting to Separate
JHF Offline
recently joined

Registered: 03/11/17
Posts: 1
I have been married to my husband since 9-30-2008 (8 years) (been together a total of 16) and we have 3 children together; ages 15, 12, and 11. From July 19, 2017 - November 6, 2017 we were living in 2 different households, but reconciled in November after my husband closed on a new house and also purchased a brand new vehicle for his estranged 19 year old daughter. Now he wants to separate again and us sign separation papers while he is still living in the house. He says he's not leaving until I sign. In a previous SAP he wanted me to sign, it listed his premarital properties (which one is actually not), listed the Waivers Of Rights, Claims, Or Benefits Relating To Wills, Trusts, Death Benefits, And Insurance Proceeds For Property Damage, Waivers of Claims against Estate, Mutual Release of Property Rights, addressed Child Custody and Care, amongst other standard SAP items (vehicles, health insurance, waiver of Alimony), but doesn't list the house that was just bought in November or the brand new vehicle he purchased for his estranged daughter. Now he is telling me he's going to let the kids and I stay in the new home, he'll provide me with a vehicle - but we will have to find a different one without as large of a payment as the van I have now, he'll continue to carry me on his health insurance until date of divorce - he says this will be 1 year or indefinitely due to him not ever wanting to get married again, He says that he will not carry auto insurance on me and continuing to provide my cell phone is contingent upon how we are getting along. In the new SAP, he wants to list the new house as his sole property. He does not want to outline that I am able to live in the home (at least until our youngest graduates), does not want to include providing me with a vehicle or a cell phone (until I'm able to start making payments or get my own), telling me that he will make house payment, pay for the gas bill (hot water, dryer, fire places), and he'll carry insurance. I will have to start paying for groceries for myself and kids, light bill, kids' extra curricular activities, Auto insurance, gas, cell phone bill, and my personal bills. He has an attorney that is drawing the SAP up, but I asked him if we could go to a divorce counselor or mediator or someone that is objective to both of us. I think he has his attorney under the impression that we both have careers. All the things I listed may seem a little selfish or like demands, but I have been a STAY-AT-HOME WIFE & MOTHER the entire 8 years we've been married. My highest education is a GED and I was never able to finish going to college. I have not had a job since 2006 and he's been very adamant that I not get one so I can raise our kids and take care of him and our home since we've been married. So basically, I have to start my entire life over again. I told him I was not asking him to set me up for life or make alimony payments to me, I just need him to continue helping me until I'm able to find some sort of job that I can start paying my way. He's also very adamant that he is not paying for me to go to school. I told him we can put a time limit on the items I'd like listed and that if I haven't figured it out by then, I'll just have to deal with it. He informed me that he IS NOT committing to those things on paper, but the more I trust him, the more he's willing to verbally agree to do for me. He isn't in the greatest of health, we are making each other miserable, he also is currently talking to other women and he's recently gone off with one. I truly do want him to be able to go out and find happiness, but I feel like it's unfair that he do that and still have complete control of my life. He says that if I won't sign the papers, he will not give me any of the tax money we just filed and that he will be retaining his lawyer and we'll go to court and that if we go to court, I will definitely get much less than what he's willing to give me. I really need some help and I just want to be fair to both of us. He's the one wanting to separate and he's already seeing other women, what do I do if he won't leave? He's doing this somewhat openly on social media and in front of our children. Still expects us to sleep in same room. Says he's not leaving the home until I sign SAP. He also told me that he's not giving me, personally, any cash for the grocery store and he's not giving me any of our tax money (it was direct deposited into his bank account that does not have my name on it (but was opened after we married -had me on it for 4 years then took me off last year). He told me he will take care of his kids but he's not responsible for me. He told me I'm using petty things I want in the agreement as leverage; housing security, vehicle, insurance, phone, and a personal bill, but he's holding money and security over my head. Yesterday he made it very clear that he was going to continue living at the house because I wasn't going to get him for abandonment and HE IS STILL SLEEPING IN OUR BED. I'm sleeping on the couch because I can't even fathom sleeping beside him. This morning he packed a book bag with clothes, shoes, his medications, and my firearm (purchased as a gift for me 4 years ago, but is now telling me he's not bringing it back and it's not really mine because he purchased it with his money). When I asked him where he was going he told me he was going off but would not tell me where. He's not setting a good example for our kids and they ate scared of the way he's acting. I'm really at my wit's end. Please help!!!

#773094 - 03/12/17 01:22 AM Re: Narcissistic Husband wanting to Separate [Re: JHF]
cupidsgym1 Offline

Registered: 07/26/07
Posts: 77
Hello JHF,
I'm no expert, certainly not a lawyer. Reading over your post, I see a whole lot of manipulation going on here. You don't have an attorney, I take it. Besides narcissistic, I'd also say he's somewhat of a bully. I would have a hard time understanding all of the conditions he's throwing out there. Do YOU really? Step back for a moment - don't get caught up in each and every one of the issues he's throwing at you - look at the big picture. The guy is bullying you, threatening you, bulls*tting you and acting like he knows everything and you don't and that he's giving you the best deal you could hope for - just sign here.
Don't sign a damn thing.
If he wants this separation so badly, perhaps you should politely suggest he move out now (completely), give you some room to think and that after that, you'd be more than happy to sign a separation agreement (just not HIS agreement, but don't say that to him). But he said that he won't let you trick him into abandonment, right? Okay, sounds like a stalemate. You refuse to sign, he refuses to leave. His girlfriend is going to get pretty impatient with him. More than likely he promised her he's got this in the bag, that you are totally under his control and he'll get you to sign his agreement. Yeah - his girlfriend. He packs a more-than-overnight bag and leaves not telling you where he is going? I'd say he's got another woman already and is just trying to get you out of the way. Now, THAT would be a good thing to be able to prove so you have something to work with towards a divorce in your favor. Hard to do, yes, but maybe it can be done.
What's with the two houses? He owns two houses? Or you both own two houses? Who's living in the other house? If he's living in it on the days he doesn't want to live with you, then it'd start to sound like he's already abandoned the marital residence. See if you can find the homeowner's policy on the other house. In NC, if the house is not occupied, then the insurance on the place is way higher than normal. Way higher. If you can find the policy, see if there is anything that alludes to the fact that the insurance company knows it's unoccupied. Maybe the policy actually makes a statement about the rate in relation to its being unoccupied. Who knows? Have a look. They'd really hate to find out it is not occupied and that he's getting away with insurance fraud. Just sayin'. You could innocently broach the subject with the insurance company, say, by calling and asking if you could get a break on the insurance premiums if you didn't keep the car there, if you moved most of the valuable property into storage, etc. till you find a buyer? (so you're going to do a sale by owner and it's not in the regular real estate listings) The agent may ask you right up front, "You mean the house is not occupied, ma'am?" Yes, that's right. I mean, you haven't tricked him into abandonment yet, right? So HE's not living there, YOU'RE not living there, so they'll jack up his insurance rate like that. Then he can argue that, uh, umm, I DO live there... don't raise my premiums! Oops - well if he swears he DOES live there, then he HAS abandoned the marital residence!
Now, the thing about the gun bothers me, though. Different things go through my mind regarding that. Think about the many other things he could have taken - things with much greater value that he would fear losing. (A lot of spouses will start selling off property to raise money for an attorney, though, I cannot attest to the legality of that. Hey, if it's property acquired after the marriage, you may well be entitled to sell it.) But the gun? Why doesn't he want YOU to have it? He doesn't care about you so much that he's afraid you'll commit suicide over this. (You'd be doing him a favor.) You're a good mother and you would never hurt your children, no way. You're not going to go upstairs one night and shoot him in his sleep and go to prison forever. But if he gets physically abusive with you to the point where you realized your life was in danger, he KNOWS he might catch a bullet if you still had the gun. He also knows now that you cannot defend yourself against an intruder if one were to conveniently decide to break in around this unsteady time. Just sayin'. Plus, if he's not bringing the gun back, then ask yourself where the hell is he leaving it? It's technically YOUR gun - probably has YOUR fingerprints on it. Though, yes, the sale of the gun will trace back to him. But still....
All in all, it definitely sounds as though he is acting strangely enough to scare his own children and is also being psychologically abusive enough to make your life "burdensome and intolerable." And THAT is another reason along with abandonment for YOU to file for divorce/separation.
Please think about these things and step back and ask yourself any common sense questions that come to mind regarding all the demands he's making in this so-called separation agreement.

#773095 - 03/12/17 01:34 AM Re: Narcissistic Husband wanting to Separate [Re: JHF]
cupidsgym1 Offline

Registered: 07/26/07
Posts: 77
Oh, one other thing: put some kind of passcode on whatever you are using for this internet access. You do not want him in your device, for a myriad of reasons. One is of course, he can trace your browsing to this site and find your post(s) and determine what your strategy is going to be to protect yourself. Plus, you don't want him planting crazy stuff in your computer/pad/phone that could be used to incriminate you. Keep your phone in a safe place if that is what you are using. Chances are you have to have it on you, which is understandable, but at least have a NEW strong passcode that he cannot get by. Got it?


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